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Setting up a single PA speaker and sub together

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  • Setting up a single PA speaker and sub together

    I just received my new TurboSound iQ12 PA speaker and iQ15B subwoofer (separate review will come.. very excited!). I come from a past where I used a sole Yamaha DXR15 PA speaker and just ran L/MONO from my TD-15 to the L/Mono Input of the speaker. Done deal. I also believe I panned all my kit instruments to Center.

    Now with this combo, I will be doing your typical setup - sub on the floor and the 12" pole mounted atop the sub. For those that tote a 1 spkr/1 sub config as well, how do you run your sound from the module for the best clarity and results?

    A) Pan the Kick drum in all your kits to max left (L15 or whatever yours is) and run a cable from L output from module to Sub input. Then either pan the rest of the kit pieces Center or hard right (R15) and run another cable from R output on the module to PA speaker input.

    B) Pan all kit instruments CTR and run single cable from L/Mono output on module into Sub input. Then from the Sub run cable from its output to the PA speaker input and configure the crossovers at the speakers appropriately.

    Let me know!

    PS - side question about crossovers - what do you guys also do for that in this setup? Do you typically do 100 or 120Hz to the sub? And if your speakers both have them, should I use the crossover feature on BOTH the 12" and the sub or will configuring just one suffice? These TurboSound speakers have some nifty DSP and modeling abilities!
    Last edited by Trip McNealy; 10-21-16, 07:00 PM.

  • #2
    If you run mono from the module, you do not have to pan everything. Mono is l+r.

    You should cross over at the point where the iQ12 runs out of bottom. It is better to cross over at a higher Hz so you don't have any weak point in the bottom end.

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    • #3
      I run my left mono out to left mono in on my sub and left and right xlr out to my two x15 wedges and one left mono out to mixing desk for FOH if needed, I use a Roland KCW1which has four inputs and four outputs which is great for this sort of setup
      .

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      • #4
        Thanks. Both the sub and 12" have Crossover functionality... if I run left mono into the sub and then from sub to 12" do I need to activate the crossover on the sub only or on both?

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        • #5
          Try it both ways but don't do both. I would feed the sub the full signal and cross it over to 12 set for full range. Just don't overdrive the 12.

          You may want to try running pink noise through the system and then use a spectrum analyzer(you can get phone apps) to see what is happening.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Trip McNealy View Post
            Thanks. Both the sub and 12" have Crossover functionality... if I run left mono into the sub and then from sub to 12" do I need to activate the crossover on the sub only or on both?
            You don't need to do both but if the high pass filter is the same frequency it shouldn't make any difference. Definitely set the frequency on the sub to crossover to the 2 way.

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            • #7
              Cool thanks.

              Since I'm running 1/4" TRS from module to the sub and using "Line" instead of "Mic" for the input, do I want to maintain using TRS from sub to the 12" or should I use XLR cable and use the "Mic" setting for that? Or consider using a DI box from module all the way through the chain and using XLR throughout? Just want to make sure I don't fudge up the signal!

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              • #8
                The DI might help. You will need a.passive one. I prefer to us a small mixer for the gain boost as well. I need it for my EV sub but some speakers have higher level inputs. A small Yamaha mixer for $100 will work and is very clean. I would not set the input to mic unless it has a lot adjustment.

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                • #9
                  Not sure of your brand but on my EVs you set the crossover mode in the UPPER speaker, the sub has it's own passthru and grabs what it needs from the full range input and fully passes the signal to the top speaker and setting the mode on the top speaker has it play less bass. So I would go from the mono out of module into sub, then sub into top, setting located in menu in top speaker. But that's EV. YMMV.

                  K
                  My bands: Alter Ego, Arcanum
                  E Kit = Roland TDW-20s kit // Roland SPD-S// Pearl Demon Drives//
                  A Kit = Tama Swingstar 5 pc (1981) w/roto toms (orig owner!) //Zildjians
                  A Kit = Natal 6 pc with Paiste 2000 & Zildjian/MidiKNights/DrumSplitters

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                  • #10
                    I've been using a similar setup but with a QSC sub and QSC K12 top (or 2) Ditto Kenster on using the speaker settings to run primary lead to sub then from sub to top. Internal speaker crossovers handle the rest. I've had the best luck eliminating unwanted hiss and being able to adapt multiple inputs with a 10 channel Yamaha mixer utilizing the onboard drum FX for a little extra presence.
                    So the hookup is short 1/4 balanced TRS from module to Mixer then balanced XLR to Sub up to 20'. Sometimes L-mono sometimes stereo depending on if I'm using 1 or 2 K12s. Another consideration you didn't mention is how are you using this speaker rig? Personal monitor, stage fill, or primary sound. Where are you placing it, Any Front Of House send? Generally I use a DI box for FOH feed from the mixer.
                    I'll run a K12 as a stage drum monitor alone. I'll use a sub and 1 K12 for smaller gigs for primary drum sounds if FOH isn't available or with FOH sent from my mixer so there is stage drum fill. Occasionally I run a sub and 2 K12s for primary if I'm battling amp wars, generally a sound mans worst nightmare but it looks cool to have Sub and the twins available for a 6K watt peak .
                    Vexed TD12 - DIY Snare, pdx100 toms, Piezoed Zildjian LV80s HH on DYI remote. KT-10 kick loaded on a RolaYamaHart mutant rack. Woody and the Twins - QSC HPR151 100lb wood cab sub, a pair of QSC K-12s as needed. Korg Wave drum, SPD-30 thru a Yamaha MG10XU mixer.

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                    • #11
                      Thanks everyone for your replies! Yea Headbanger most venues I play don't have FOH available so we run our own sound. For some reason my bass player, who primarily runs the main mixer board and PA speaker setup, is hellbent on the idea that drums muddy up the vocals through the PA.... so I just run my own primary sound. I have new TurboSound iQ12 PA speaker and iQ15 Sub setup - they are very loud and have cool DSP features, etc. I will try your suggestions running through sub first then to the top.. I got a Whirlwind passive DI box for Xmas so I will run a short unbalanced TS from L/Mono Out on the TD module into the DI then from there XLR cables to the speaker setup.

                      Eventually, I'll add a second iQ12 speaker and have a similar setup as you.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Trip McNealy View Post
                        Thanks everyone for your replies! Yea Headbanger most venues I play don't have FOH available so we run our own sound. For some reason my bass player, who primarily runs the main mixer board and PA speaker setup, is hellbent on the idea that drums muddy up the vocals through the PA.... so I just run my own primary sound..
                        Blasphemy!!!!!! We have a blasphemer!!!!! It's your bass player's way of thinking that gives e drums a bad rep! How is his hellbent idea overriding facts to the contrary? Show him some stuff that says edrums are fine in FOH and that you are robbing THE AUDIENCE of much needed percussion. The only way it works without drums in FOH is if the edrums have a stage monitor so flippin big it might as well be a FOH on it's own.

                        You need to re educate your bass player, it's rampant thinking and feelings that are WRONG about edrums that are killing the opportunities to play live with them. If the vocals are muddy when the edrums are in the mix there cold be LOTS of issues going on..EQ, cabling, type of songs/sounds and frequencies in the music itself harmonically interfering with the vocals, the vocalist himself may not project enough, PA underpowered, FOH mix not correct, type and kit of edrum sounds selected, etc etc etc Just my 2 cents.



                        My bands: Alter Ego, Arcanum
                        E Kit = Roland TDW-20s kit // Roland SPD-S// Pearl Demon Drives//
                        A Kit = Tama Swingstar 5 pc (1981) w/roto toms (orig owner!) //Zildjians
                        A Kit = Natal 6 pc with Paiste 2000 & Zildjian/MidiKNights/DrumSplitters

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                        • #13
                          Yep, agreed with ken in every way, blasphemy!
                          Every venue I've been to or played has the whole band running through foh.
                          The band as a whole needs to be eq'ed properly to have clarity indivigially. It is the sound man's job to mix it right.
                          Roland TD 20 bk, TD 20X, VH13, Roc-N-Soc,Tama Iron Cobra, Iron cobra high hat stand, Cobra clutch, Pearl throne thumper, Kit Toys, Gibraltar rack, Roland KC 500,
                          Audio Technica ADH50X, BBE Sonic Maximizer

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                          • #14
                            It's a valid statement given that, when there is a PA, it is usually underpowered and that will suck the life out of a vocal on low freq hits. A poorly set compressor will also do this. I have seen too many sound systems compressors set wrong.
                            With a properly sized system though, you should have no problems with any transient issues.
                            TD-9_stealth Yamaha, HPD-15, HPD-10, Octapad etc.

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                            • #15
                              Preaching to the choir guys... lol. To your recent points, yea our PA sucks pretty bad - it's a piecemeal of a Bose, Fishman, some Alto 15", and a EV 12".. depending on where we play.. all running through a Mackie 12-ch mixer. We do not have a dedicated sound person.. neither does any bar we play in NJ pretty much. The bass player mainly sets up the PA at every gig. I could write a novel on the discussions I have had with him.. he tends to be anal and controlling with the sound.. so I just give up.. The # of gigs and pay that we take in is just too good to argue over it right now. If we ever got a proper PA with a sound person, you'd bet I'd always be through FOH. With the equipment we have now, just not really possible. I just bring my 15" sub to mic my A kit or when I use the Rolands, the 12"/15" sub setup like I started this post off with.
                              Last edited by Trip McNealy; 01-13-17, 05:33 PM.

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