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**Rythmstik** · 10-23-02, 02:59 PM

I don't know the answers to your questions, but I love that quote!

**darrenmc** · 10-26-02, 01:25 AM

Re: Waiting for the next generation of e-drums

Originally posted by savendrummer
Hey guys this is my first post, but I'm no stranger to e-drums, I still have my td-7 kit my dad got me when I was 12(ten years ago), and I bought and then sold a td-8, and pintech and roland mesh head pads.

I've been playing mostly acoustics for two years, and I'm not thinking on giving up my A's 'cause there is nothing like acoustic, but I'm still very interested in e-drums, but I think I'm gonna wait for the next wave of e-drums, I mean sometimes I wanna squeeze a ddrum4, or a td-6/8/10 out of my visa card, but then I hold back, and think about saving some dough for the next generation of e-drums.

Do any of you guys know any FACTS about future e-drum stuff.

later

I don't know any facts about future e-drum stuff, but I agree with you... I too want the 'next generation' of e-drums. I want a TD-12 or ddrum5. The current top of the line modules don't do it for me. That being said, a TD-6 is a very cost effective piece of gear if you want to keep your hand in the edrum arena, and as an apartment dweller I certainly do! (esp if you can pick one up used). They are apparently quite reliable and they sound fine. I think the TD-6 is a great module to 'tide you over' until the new stuff comes out.

But as for the pads, I don't have any reservations. I think the Hart Pro series are the best out there, and will serve you well for a long time without being supplanted by something better. I'm still planning on buying some, the only reason I didn't was that I got a good deal on a barely used club kit and money is a bit tight for me right now. My only quibble is that I'm not a big fan of their finishes.

I played the Hart Pros with a ddrum 4 and it was the best edrum experience I've had. Only problem... 10 inputs on a module is simply not good enough.

I think the Roland v-cymbals are the best cymbals out there (except for the Ride, Hart Pro again there), and I think they'll be good for a long time, but they are, without question, very overpriced.

There is a rumour that Yamaha will update the DXtreme. I hope they do, because right now I think it's a dog. I thought it was OK at first, but the more times I try it, the more I hate it.

My 2 cents,
Darren

**Cyberjam** · 10-26-02, 08:23 AM

Re: Waiting for the next generation of e-drums

Sorry no facts. The edrum Gods are very thin lipped about the future of edrums. We can speculate till the cows come home.

If you are ok with your current setup then hunker down and wait. It could be a few years or a few minutes...

I had a friend that told me he was going to wait for the best possible computer setup for his home. He is still waiting and its been like five years now...

Your Dave quote is priceless, probably one of the reasons why he was a solo act.

Good luck...

**savendrummer** · 10-28-02, 05:45 PM

Thanx about the comments about he quote.

By the way Dave is not on his own, he's actually back with SLAYER, and I had the privilege of seeing them recently, man did they kick ass. He'll be playing on the upcoming SLAYER album, plus Fantomas, and his other projects.

Thanx for the reply's fellows

**sepdrums** · 10-28-02, 08:24 PM

Well,
Sure there will be a ddrum5....hands down....and the TD12, or whatever Roland names it.... But I don't see the technology of edrums really advancing that much this time....maybe the ddrum5 will have 24 bit samples....maybe the TD12 will have a touch screen monitor...wooopdee friggin doo....

What are we striving for with edrums?? Acoustic feel? Never gonna do it with mesh trampoline heads. Acoustic look??? Been there, played that...it is easy to do....
So what are we after? The technology may lie in the next generation of pad to module translation.... Piezo's are the perfect little tool...self powered, cheap.... but is there something better?? Perhaps it can be built into the head itself....

If the Rolands and Ddrums of the world can create a module that triggers faster, plays high-fi samples, plays loops, can save gigabites of information, wipes your ass, brews your beer, and tucks you in at night, then I will shut up. However like Intel, they will upgrate a little at a time..... Ddrum5, 6, 7, 8.....

The technology exists to use fiber optics woven into mesh heads and the bending of light as a trigger source....why though?? To what extent does an edrum need to be taken??

I think it is at a point where it will either evolve into a disgusting technological nightmare, or it will level out with minor improvements in sound quality and memory space.

Enough rambling.... where the hell are my sennheisers??

Erik

**Cyberjam** · 10-28-02, 09:58 PM

Originally posted by savendrummer

By the way Dave is not on his own, he's actually back with SLAYER, and I had the privilege of seeing them recently, man did they kick ass. He'll be playing on the upcoming SLAYER album, plus Fantomas, and his other projects.

[/B]

They are back together?

Excellent!

There is just something about the way he puts it together that I really like...

**Calken** · 10-29-02, 07:12 AM

I believe that any trigger based sampling system will always sound a bit rigid and electric in comparison to an A kit. Maybe Roland should move towards an acoustic modelling system simular to the line6 pod products. The PD-120 has a great feel (especially when compared to the PD-6!) but if the mesh could send an analogue signal that could be modelled rather than a trigger, its possible that a much more natural feeling kit could be achieved.

Samples have serious limitations when you are trying to be expressive with an instrument. Moving away from triggers and towards acoustic modelling may also combat the spiralling costs of the higher end VDrums. Resonance might be a problem when playing live. Completely a hypothetical system you understand.

**gingerbaker** · 10-29-02, 09:11 AM

an electronic novice

Feefer shared a really cool site re a fabric mesh which was a sensor array - a positional and velocity sensor by its inherent nature.

What is the practical limit for adding nuance to the drums and cymbals so far as the processing power for samples and Cosm modeling and/or the analog modeling described above. ( Sorry - I don't understand the differences between the two modeling concepts- what a maroon!!)

In other words, have the advances in computing power and memory chips of the last five years allowed a practical manufacturing goal of truly improving expressive nuance and faithful reproduction of acoustic drums, or are we just rearranging the chairs on the Titanic?

Thanks, guys

**Calken** · 10-29-02, 10:59 AM

Todays embedded systems could easily provide a cheap, high performance COSM based processer (not DSP). Modelling is based on algorithmic application to an input to provide a desired output. Algorithms can be very compact and applicable to any input. If given an implementation of such an embedded system the addition of fully programmable effects would not be too difficult either.

When sampling sounds they need to be stored somewhere, normally in ROM. I don't know how big the chip is on the 6,8 or 10 but it is fairly expensive to manufacture larger ones (in comparison to other components)

I have thought of one serious problem with acoustic modelling though, you wouldn't be able to trigger sounds and rythms from a midi signal.

**ChadHipas** · 11-09-02, 11:45 PM

Wait, are we still talking about flipping over a 5 gallon bucket and bangin' on it with drumsticks?

**ExBassPlayer** · 11-10-02, 11:32 PM

A nice feature that could be added to V-Drums would be to have the actual pad produce a sound output (as opposed to using headphones or an amp).

That is the one thing that lacks with the V-Drums. With acoustics, you get the sound/vibration of each drum, which produces an energy, . . . as opposed to just whacking dead plastic.

**Ranman** · 11-11-02, 04:25 AM

Originally posted by ExBassPlayer
A nice feature that could be added to V-Drums would be to have the actual pad produce a sound output (as opposed to using headphones or an amp).

That is the one thing that lacks with the V-Drums. With acoustics, you get the sound/vibration of each drum, which produces an energy, . . . as opposed to just whacking dead plastic.

Alternatively, that is the main thing lacking in acoustics in that there is no easy way to isolate their output and send it as a single source to the board. IMO: that's actually one of the great features of the E's.

**Danny159753** · 11-11-02, 06:55 AM

So people want a drumset that looks, feels, sounds and vibrates like an acoustic set? er.... buy an acoustic set?

I'm sure this has been covered many times in the forum but E's have their advantages and disadvantages and A's have their advantages and disadvantages. There is only so much that can be done to E's to make them like A's - and if you really want them exactly like A's then i don't think its worth using electronics (how about a 'stick splintering' setting? or a 'cymbal cracking' button?) I'm a newish v-drum user and love using the v's for what they are.

**...andrelax** · 11-11-02, 07:48 AM

Originally posted by Danny159753
I'm a newish v-drum user and love using the v's for what they are.

yes they're a different instrument really; i still haven't made a decent public performance with mine.

my wish for vrdums is that rather than two samples per iinstrument blended according to how hard you hit it, i wish they'd do 128ish samples of the same instrument being hit progressively harder - that way it wouldn't have to sound exactly the same all the time and would be sooo much more accurate.
i'd rather a couple of accurate kits than 1024 different quitegood ones.

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Waiting for the next generation of e-drums

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