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Dilemma?feedback please.

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  • Dilemma?feedback please.

    After waiting a few years I have in my possession a TD-12 module.I thought I would be upgrading. After playing this for a few hours I am bewildered and disappointed.There are some definite bright points to this TD-12 module, but overall this really does not hold a candle to my TD-10.I am curious if anyone has had the opportunity to compare these two units side by side.Unless I am missing something the snares especially on the TD-12 are deficient to say the least.I really would savour some feedback on this Dilemma.

    P.S. BTW obviously I never checked it out at a music store as it would have been an undertaking in itself, instead I watched the Roland videos and youtube clips.From all the info I have read the PD-100 & PD 120 should not make that much difference correct??
    TD -10 EXP V-PRO, TD-12 module,HPD-15,SPD-30 ,SPD-SX dual trigger toms,upgraded V-cymbals Korg Karma,M-3, Pearl Eliminator DBL pedals,KD-120, Sonor Maple acoustic, Zildjian Cymbals
    Gene Krupa,Mitch Mitchell,Akira Jimbo,Milos Meier

  • #2
    this is a follow up from technical forum.I set the correct trigger assignments for the correct pads on the 12 and the sound quality is just not there.To DBL check I re-cabled everything back into my TD-10 and shazam!!there is NO comparison!! Either I need to do something in addition to the trigger assignments or this (used) TD-12 is malfunctioning.Feedback please.
    TD -10 EXP V-PRO, TD-12 module,HPD-15,SPD-30 ,SPD-SX dual trigger toms,upgraded V-cymbals Korg Karma,M-3, Pearl Eliminator DBL pedals,KD-120, Sonor Maple acoustic, Zildjian Cymbals
    Gene Krupa,Mitch Mitchell,Akira Jimbo,Milos Meier

    Comment


    • #3
      Logan,

      While I'm not entirely sure what you are expecting to hear that you are not, you are not alone in this assessment. It is generally agreed that the stock kits on the TD12 and TD20 are very lackluster. If you have not already, check out Vexpressionsltd.com and buy at least one set of tweaks from them before you pass final judgement. These are not new samples, but expertly tweaked kits from the samples that come on the module. I got the Master Picks collection when I first got my TD20 and the difference was quite significant.

      The TD12 (and 20) do not give the same "out of the box" satisfaction experience that the TD10 (and even some of the Yamaha modules) do, but believe me, the potential is there. Compression, EQ, Ambience, Effects, and other settings, properly applied, will give you results you will almost certainly agree are superior in depth and versatility to the TD10.

      I played on a TD10 when I had to put my TD20 in for warranty service. At that time, I had already installed the Master Picks on my TD20. I definitely felt the TD10 was a step back. Since the TD12 has the same samples and basic capabilities, I think that it is simple a matter of getting the settings right.

      It is vexing that Roland did not do a better a job getting the most out of these fine modules, and that it takes a third-party solution to pull out the full potential, but I'm glad the VEX people are there, and that this forum is here. It has augmented my enjoyment of my TD20 immensely.
      Id rather be told the ugly truth than handed a pretty lie.

      Comment


      • #4
        Didn't realize the TD-12 was used. A factory reset may have been worthwhile, but if you do that now you'd need to reset all the trigger types you just set. You could check at SETUP, OUTPUT, PAD that the snare is routed to Master (and Phones) outputs. If it had been sent to a direct output for live or recording use, you could just be hearing ambience and/or effects.

        Bruce

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        • #5
          I think the TD12 is probably really messed up. I recommend giving it to me. I'll send you my shipping address by PM and I'll be happy to take it off of your hands.

          Shalom
          Bruce

          Comment


          • #6
            I did the factory reset right off.When I go to setup /output ,everything is on the top 2 lines master L/R. Another challenge brought to my attention this morning is my tom #4 is cabled into aux #1 it is a muted sound. I can vaguely make the sound out if I hit the pad very gently.???
            Last edited by logan; 01-03-09, 08:21 AM.
            TD -10 EXP V-PRO, TD-12 module,HPD-15,SPD-30 ,SPD-SX dual trigger toms,upgraded V-cymbals Korg Karma,M-3, Pearl Eliminator DBL pedals,KD-120, Sonor Maple acoustic, Zildjian Cymbals
            Gene Krupa,Mitch Mitchell,Akira Jimbo,Milos Meier

            Comment


            • #7
              I don't know if this is the case with your module or not. I once purchased a used TD-6 on eBay. When it got here EVERY sound and kit sounded terrible. I tweaked and tweaked and did a reset on the unit but all of the kits sounded like toys. I sent it back for a refund. A few months later, I ran on to a deal on another TD-6. Just for fun I picked it up. To my surprise, it sounded infinitely better than the previous one I had. I'm not sure why. Maybe the previous owner just messed it up that bad or maybe it was malfuntioning somehow, but there was a distinct difference between the same two models of module. The VExpressions kits took my TD-6 up another 2 steps.

              Comment


              • #8
                The TD-12 should be sounding really good. I went from the TD-8 to the TD-20 and was blown away. Of course I got used to it and then wanted more. (So I got more... VEX packs, expansion card...)

                Still, something sounds funny here. I have heard many of Joe_K's recordings with the TD-10, all nicely eq-ed and mixed, and they had a deadness in the drums (particularly the snare) that the TD-12 doesn't.

                I can understand being disappointed with the TD-12, but not in comparison with the TD-10.
                . . . . . . . . . .
                V stage with TD20 and TDW-20, pd-80s, pd-7s, pd-125, vh-12, cy-12rc, dB 405 L and Yorkville LS 700p
                Core2duo in a Cube with 2 gig of RAM and 2 HDDs, Sonar Producer 6, DFHS Custom and Vintage, and RME Multiface II

                "Make me an instrument of your peace..."

                Comment


                • #9
                  I understand your frustration Logan, the TD-12 out of the box compared to say a TD-6 was very disappointing but with perseverance you can start to get the sounds you want, it just takes time.
                  I bought the VEX Vintage kit and again out of the box it came alive, SuperPuss' Studio kits are very good as well.
                  Hopefully you have a computer and midi cable to upload the kits to the brain. You'll also need to buy this software, it's cheap and does a lot for tweaking individual drums.

                  http://www.vdrumlib.com/convert_kits.html

                  Don't do anything rash, they (td-12's) sound fantastic when done right. There's something about the TD-10, like the TD-6's, they are very good, the TD-6 out of the box was the best I've had.
                  Nothing of importance here

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Just to echo Sook. I upgraded from a TD12 from a TD-6 and was somewhat disappointed when I set it up out of the box, although there was a clear improvement in the hats and the resonance of the toms. I immediately bought a VEX pack and have been very happy with it since then, although I still tend to stick to a few kits that I like best.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      do the vex kits tweak the 50 defaults on the TD-12? If they totally replace them how easy is it to return to the defaults.How much $ are we talking to get up and running with a vex 50 pack (everything one needs) Is the interface the same interface you need to run recording software.
                      Purchased this module from e-bay got burned ( not worth the $250 difference) Without sending it to roland for examination or running up on another TD-12 for relativity,I will never know.
                      TD -10 EXP V-PRO, TD-12 module,HPD-15,SPD-30 ,SPD-SX dual trigger toms,upgraded V-cymbals Korg Karma,M-3, Pearl Eliminator DBL pedals,KD-120, Sonor Maple acoustic, Zildjian Cymbals
                      Gene Krupa,Mitch Mitchell,Akira Jimbo,Milos Meier

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Hmm... based on comments from various (old and new) threads, it seems out-of-the-box playability of the stock kits goes like this:

                        TD-6 > TD-8 > TD-10 > TD-12/20

                        The more you pay the worse out-of-the-box experience you get?!
                        My compact kit.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by logan View Post
                          do the vex kits tweak the 50 defaults on the TD-12? If they totally replace them how easy is it to return to the defaults.How much $ are we talking to get up and running with a vex 50 pack (everything one needs) Is the interface the same interface you need to run recording software.
                          Purchased this module from e-bay got burned ( not worth the $250 difference) Without sending it to roland for examination or running up on another TD-12 for relativity,I will never know.
                          The vex kits replace all (or as many as you want) of the 50 preset kits. However, once you have loaded up the VEX kits you can still access the preset kits through the demo function (Go into the demo screen (shift + chain/demo), select the Kit line. Dial up the kit you want - you can access all of the stock kits). So you do actually have access to 100 kits.

                          Check the cost of the TD-12 and TD-20 kits at http://www.vexpressionsltd.com/
                          You should contact Alan (AKA Amonline on this forum) at Vexpressions and discuss your requirements regarding kits - you might want to buy a TD-20 kit and convert it to a TD-12 kit, which is what I have done. One of the easiest ways to do the file transfer to the module is to use Vdrumlib software (other software options are available) - you can trial Vdrumlib for free then pay your subscription if you are happy. You will also need a suitable lead to connect your computer to the module - again, see Alan about which one they are currently recommending. Alan is the Vex shizzy (as they say around here).

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by logan View Post
                            do the vex kits tweak the 50 defaults on the TD-12? If they totally replace them how easy is it to return to the defaults.How much $ are we talking to get up and running with a vex 50 pack (everything one needs) Is the interface the same interface you need to run recording software.
                            Purchased this module from e-bay got burned ( not worth the $250 difference) Without sending it to roland for examination or running up on another TD-12 for relativity,I will never know.
                            The vexpacks create totally new drumkits, using the stock sounds. go here to check prices: http://www.vexpressionsltd.com/. but they seem to start at about 65 dollars - but a very good investment. you can always reload the stock kits, though the easy way to keep track of everything is through vdrum library, that will set you back another 20 dollars or so http://www.vdrumlib.com/
                            TD9+6v with Diamond Electronic pads, and cowbell.
                            ATH-50m headphones, VEX packs
                            not to mention keyboards, guitars, basses, and cats

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by sciomako View Post
                              Hmm... based on comments from various (old and new) threads, it seems out-of-the-box playability of the stock kits goes like this:

                              TD-6 > TD-8 > TD-10 > TD-12/20

                              The more you pay the worse out-of-the-box experience you get?!
                              I think that just reflects the capacity of the module to tweak the sounds, and the apparent desire by roland to produce a range of default kit sounds to suit all tastes and styles. The better modules have greater capacity for tweaking the sounds to make them more like just how you want them. But having said that, you'd think that Roland could do a bit better by getting the Vex boys to set them up with some kits......

                              I've just had a thought! Maybe they already do... but those sneaky people at Vexpressions make the kits sound so bad that it's all a ploy to get you to buy their other kits

                              Comment

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