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advice and guidance for beginner

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  • advice and guidance for beginner


  • #2
    First, welcome to the community and welcome to the art of drumming!

    Although I am not an expert by any means I am happy to offer my opinions and recommendations on what I do know.

    1. You can't really go wrong with Roland kits and you will be VERY happy with either the TD-9 or TD-12. Personally, I have the TD-12 but I have also tested the TD-9 and would highly recommend either one. The typical consensus around here is to get the most kit that your budget will allow (meaning, try to get the higher end equipment upfront rather than upgrading in the near future if your budget permits). With that said, however, it also depends on your needs and what all you want from your kit. If you want a very user friendly "plug and play" type and you don't think you will need the additional trigger inputs then I think the TD-9 is a perfect kit for you. If you think you will like/need the adjustability of each trigger and feel you might use the additional trigger outlets then the TD-12 is plenty of kit.

    2. While I don't know a thing about RockBand or any other console band game, I do know about the infamous "drumless" song issue. At present (unless I have been totally thrown for a loop here), there is not an extensive list of drumless music out there. You may find a few well known songs with the drum tracks removed but often times the vocals have been removed as well. I'm not sure if it's a licensing issue with the original artists or what but for whatever reason its not really out there. You will probably have much more from the "practice songs" in RockBand or whatever you are talking about then we have otherwise. There are, however, backing patterns and instrumentals that you can play along with but you will be hard pressed to find your favorite artist songs with the drums removed. Perhaps there is software for this but I am not familiar with it and I would think that if someone is already doing it then the drumless songs would be online somewhere..... but, there are a few out there.

    My final thoughts are: I think you will be very happy with either of the two sets that you listed. The two most important aspects for me personally are mesh heads and VExpression pack compatible (make sure you look into VEX packs to liven up your kit... its a download from your computer to the Roland brain/module - when its time for that I'm sure someone on here will help you).

    I hope this helps a bit.

    Happy shopping!

    Comment


    • #3
      Hi Mate, I gigged for 25 years on acoustic and after a long lay-off Ive come back to it with a TD6V which Im very happy with, (apart from the FD8 hihat pedal).

      The TD9 has now superceeded the 6, so if your happy with a 5 drum, 3 cymbal set-up then the TD9 kit will be perfect for you. I assume the 9 is the same as the 6 and there are 2 ports that can be split for 2 extra pads.

      Like Soprano says though, if you can afford it, go for the 12.

      Dont forget to budget for a decent throne and kick pedals. This could add another £300 to the price. You must get a decent pedal/s if your serious. Crap pedals cramp your progress.

      Good luck mate.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by kingrottenboy View Post
        I am an apartment dweller, and after asking around, ( a guy named Cena over at rockgamer clued me in on the mesh heads of the roland kits.) I decided to get a roland kit.
        Be warned - electronic drum kits are not completely silent. In particular, the base drums are known to transmit a great deal of vibration that can upset your neighbors. It won't be the same as your video game pads.
        >>>See my E-kit here<<<

        >>>See my A-kit here<<<

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by John.b View Post
          Hi Mate, I gigged for 25 years on acoustic and after a long lay-off Ive come back to it with a TD6V which Im very happy with, (apart from the FD8 hihat pedal).

          The TD9 has now superceeded the 6, so if your happy with a 5 drum, 3 cymbal set-up then the TD9 kit will be perfect for you. I assume the 9 is the same as the 6 and there are 2 ports that can be split for 2 extra pads.
          .
          No it cant! But the 9 does have 10 inputs, so you can go with a 4th tom or a third crash

          it also has some good coaching functions like the visual scope metronome, and the ability to mute different parts of the built in songs, so you can go drumless, or justkeep the drums to learn their part, or just jam to the bass....

          there aer lots of sites offering drumless tracks...search for drumless on this forum and you will get lots...here's one for starters:

          http://www.roland.com/V-Drums/download/index.html
          TD9+6v with Diamond Electronic pads, and cowbell.
          ATH-50m headphones, VEX packs
          not to mention keyboards, guitars, basses, and cats

          Comment


          • #6
            I changed from acoustics to roland drums. I got fed up with having to mute my acoustics to the point of them sound really crappy, so i bought myself a td8k 4 years ago. They are brilliant bits of kit, they take a bit of getting used too. Put it this way after 4 years of me playing the kit it still works as good as new. very well engineerd. I think it's a mix of the td9 and td 12 without the hi-hat.

            As a previous poster stated they do make some noise, the base drum especially. it's more vibration than noise. I just created a small hollow platform and put my drums on that. Works a charm .

            With regards to the 2nd question there is a website called www.puredarkness.com (i think) which has a load of drumless tracks. The roland module itself won't have the technology to strip away the drums, so you will have to download/buy tracks without the drums.

            To be honest i just play along to music with the drums on. Doesn't bother me if there is another drummer in the background i just zone them out. mind you i've been playing for over 10 years, i can see it being a bit more difficult if i was just starting.

            Comment


            • #7
              If you start to get serious about playing drums, a word of caution.
              The drummer is the leader of the group when it comes to laying down the beat and keeping the tempo for the rest of the band. When you play along with drumless tracks, you are following THEIR lead. Doing this too much when starting out on drums ignores the development of timekeeping that is ESSENTIAL. Either module has a metronome and I highly recommend you use it to practice with, as much as (if not more often) than you do play-along tracks.
              Good luck!

              Comment


              • #8
                I'm new to electronic drumming as well and recently got a TD-12s kit to replace my acoustic one. I have done some pretty extensive searching for drumless play-along tracks and what you basically get are a lot of crappy covers and no vocals. Not fun at all! I am not sure why no one has created software akin to what guitar players have with Guitar Port Online. Seems the sound modules would be a perfect fit for this type of software on the PC.

                So, if you want to play along with drumless master tracks, you do what I do (and that you mentioned). You feed Rock Band/Rock Band 2 or Guitar Hero World Tour practice modes into the mix in and you get drumless master tracks. Advantage is that the Rock Band library is very deep (literally 500+ tracks available for download and probably 90% of them are master tracks). You're sure to find something you like. One other advantage to this is that you get kind of a scrolling sheet music approach to learning the songs. As you play along, you'll still see the Rock Band chart scrolling by. While this by no means is a great chart (identifying toms/cymbal differences on this "chart" is difficult but is easy once you know the song), it is a nice visual cue of where the beat is and what the general part is supposed to be (provided you practice on Expert mode). Not a perfect solution, but it is the best I have found.

                Here's a video of me doing exactly this playing along to Roxanne using Rock Band 2's practice mode fed into my mix-in. Keep in mind I was just messing around, and I'm not very good. I screw up at least 3 or 4 times in this video...but I was sight reading the scrolling "chart". If anyone is curious, I just used the stock kit #1 for this. Not a bad fit...
                http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vFwHgAZ4fbM

                Comment


                • #9
                  Delmonte: Brilliant first post! What a nifty idea.

                  Crazen: Like you, I've never had any trouble practicing to regular tracks with drums in em. I just turn me up to drown out the backing track. It also drowns out everything else. That might explain a lot about my drumming "skills".

                  www.myspace.com/rubberuniverse
                  TD-12, DTX502, SD1000, EZDrummer, Diamond Drum 12" snare, S1000 toms/cymbals/kick, PCY10/100/135/155, CY-5/14, Hart Ride, Hart Acupad 8" kick, Epedal Pro II, Concept 1 pads/cymbals, SD1000 & Roland V Sessions racks, PD-7, Kit Toy 10" splash, DMPad ride, SamplePad, PerformancePad Pro

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    If you can afford the 12, get the 12. It is second in line to the top of Roland modules (the vaunted TD-20). I was told a long time ago to get the best module you can afford and pass this on to others.
                    Hawk snare, toms, and bass; Hart ECII crashes & ride; VH-10 Hihat; Iron Cobra double-bass.
                    "I never play the same thing twice...sometimes because I simply can't remember it." - John Paul Jones

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by grog View Post
                      Delmonte: Brilliant first post! What a nifty idea.

                      www.myspace.com/rubberuniverse
                      Thanks. I need to re-record that video and actually play the correct parts. So far the only songs I've really gotten decent at are Roxanne and Hotel California. Hopefully I improve over time. My hands are fine (marched snare for phantom regiment in '95 and '96), but my feet betray me.

                      Another thing you can do with the rock band input is practice individual sections of the song too. Rock band loops it and you can just keep trying it over and over. GH:WT for some reason doesn't loop sections, which can be annoying to have to keep going through the menu to re-play a section.

                      One last thing you can do is slow down a section. This drops the backing instruments (leaves a click track I think?) but at least slows down the scrolling "chart" so you can practice a tricky section, then bump it back up to speed with the backing parts once you have the hang of it.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Delmonte View Post
                        Thanks. I need to re-record that video and actually play the correct parts. So far the only songs I've really gotten decent at are Roxanne and Hotel California. Hopefully I improve over time. My hands are fine (marched snare for phantom regiment in '95 and '96), but my feet betray me.

                        Another thing you can do with the rock band input is practice individual sections of the song too. Rock band loops it and you can just keep trying it over and over. GH:WT for some reason doesn't loop sections, which can be annoying to have to keep going through the menu to re-play a section.

                        One last thing you can do is slow down a section. This drops the backing instruments (leaves a click track I think?) but at least slows down the scrolling "chart" so you can practice a tricky section, then bump it back up to speed with the backing parts once you have the hang of it.

                        DelMonte:

                        I am a converted Rock Band gamer that's now into Roland. I was actually going to do the same exact thing you did (take the drumless audio and add the Roland Drums) and was going to do it to Buddy Holly. Never got around to doing it since i've been so busy. There is absolutely nothing better in Rock Band than playing with a REAL kit and not a toy.


                        Kingrottenboy:

                        I would go with whatever your budget can afford. Look into used gear too on Ebay or your local craigslist. I started with a used TD3 kit and now after a series of upgrades I run a full TD20 kit. Beware of GAS.
                        Fufill your GAS problems here at my eBay store: Drums By DjPiLL

                        Check out my new Drum Outlet eBay Store for various CHEAP percussion hardware: DJ's Drum Outlet

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Delmonte View Post
                          I'm new to electronic drumming as well and recently got a TD-12s kit to replace my acoustic one. I have done some pretty extensive searching for drumless play-along tracks and what you basically get are a lot of crappy covers and no vocals. Not fun at all! I am not sure why no one has created software akin to what guitar players have with Guitar Port Online. Seems the sound modules would be a perfect fit for this type of software on the PC.

                          So, if you want to play along with drumless master tracks, you do what I do (and that you mentioned). You feed Rock Band/Rock Band 2 or Guitar Hero World Tour practice modes into the mix in and you get drumless master tracks. Advantage is that the Rock Band library is very deep (literally 500+ tracks available for download and probably 90% of them are master tracks). You're sure to find something you like. One other advantage to this is that you get kind of a scrolling sheet music approach to learning the songs. As you play along, you'll still see the Rock Band chart scrolling by. While this by no means is a great chart (identifying toms/cymbal differences on this "chart" is difficult but is easy once you know the song), it is a nice visual cue of where the beat is and what the general part is supposed to be (provided you practice on Expert mode). Not a perfect solution, but it is the best I have found.

                          Here's a video of me doing exactly this playing along to Roxanne using Rock Band 2's practice mode fed into my mix-in. Keep in mind I was just messing around, and I'm not very good. I screw up at least 3 or 4 times in this video...but I was sight reading the scrolling "chart". If anyone is curious, I just used the stock kit #1 for this. Not a bad fit...
                          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vFwHgAZ4fbM
                          Delmonte -

                          I sent you a PM.

                          Thanks.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            what interface

                            delmonte on the youtube video what device are using to interface with rockband game, are you using the j5 box or the midi controller? also I haven't played rockband 2 yet, but have you messed around with the drum trainer in the game? how do you find it with a real kit?

                            thanks everyone for the advice, before I was considering picking up a 9sx or a 12sv , now its between the 12sv and the 20,.... part of me is rationalizing get a 20 because I think I can recover most of difference in cost when I resale it...

                            thats how I am trying to convince myself....

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I'm not using any device to interface with rock band. I'm playing the parts myself! The audio out of the xbox 360 is being fed into the mix-in and I'm adding the drum track myself.

                              That being said, I HAVE plugged the Roland triggers into the ION Drum Rocker module and played the game that way (which turns the td-12s into a $2800 game controller). It works great. I don't play the game much anymore though. Much more fun to play the real thing.

                              NOTE: to use the roland kick triggers you need a device such as a kickbox to translate the signal into an input the rockband/ghwt modeles recognize. Their rock band kicks are just on/off switches (and they suck). I don't have a kickbox yet so when I played the rock band game with the roland, I just used the pedal that came with the ION. There's a video of it here:
                              http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hyadGR_U8RI

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