disillusioned TD12 owner

[Sook]

Hey guys, I thought I'd best do an intro on the main page, I bore the wife to tears so why not you guys :-)

I have two bands atm, the Monday one we are trying to do a 1/2 descent covers band and seem to do well enough I suppose. I've had a TD-6 for a while now and it's been giving some great recordings, I just bought a TD-12, well the shiet hit the wall on Monday. The drummer just hated it, went on for an hour how Roland is always wrecking a good products with a new updated ones.

I bought it and I'm not the drummer I play the guitar so I'm wondering if I've done the wrong thing. It does sound boomy and real sounding compared to the sweet conditioned sound of the TD-6 and even the TD-3 I first had. A bit disappointing really as I'd expect a drummer to know if it's good, so I trust him. I was going to add the TD6 on to the 12 but I don't have that sort of money to hold on to it.
I'll put some pics up of my studio (really just my old workroom)

Steve

[Charly]

Firstly tell the drummer to stop whinging.

Secondly maybe invest in some VEX packs, but really... what are you trying to achieve? The TD12 sounds 'real sounding'?

What kits specifically did the drummer like on the 6? Then maybe people here can suggest.

[Relayer]

Take it back. That's too much money to invest in something you don't feel good about. Better yet, take it all back and remind the drummer that it's his responsibility to provide his own instrument and STFU. Anyway, it's the same awful COSM sounds in both modules - if for some reason you prefer the TD-6, go back to it. While I would never agree that any synth patch posing as a drum sample was "real sounding", I'm also puzzled as to why this is a problem.

Good luck.

Steve

[daveybabes]

Sorry but Your drummer is a total ass

When i went from TD6 to 12 i noticed it's real sounding and basically had to learn how to utilise it from scratch as it was a bit daunting suddenly having something with such high quality life like drum sounds. As for the boomy yep! it's a real beast that CAN be tamed and tailored to perfection just like an acoustic kit. The rewards are totally fantastic. Thy shalt tweak thine Vex kits and be a happy bunny he he

I totally love it !!! it is basically every drummers dream to have one of these and your drummer has taken one look, realised he has to learn how to use it and rejected it cos it involves a bit of work and he probably doesn't have the brain matter to suss it out.

WOW! to have a band member buy me a 12? you are 1 in a million ... hang on it's 7.30 am here maybe i'm still dreaming?

come over here and start a band with me mate

Take it back, get your money back and never buy anything for a band member again unless it's me

You sound like a caring soul and a great guy but you really have to look after yourself in this crazy cruel world

Gheez! i don't believe it, if someone got me a TD20 i would marry them ha ha

[beeboy]

Your Drummer is a dipstick, make Him buy his own drumkit.

[froe234]

You could always give it to me, I love the td12 and want to own one muchly.

[Sook]

Well that was a few interesting replies :-) As it is I've sent him a DCM and I'm putting the other guitarist onto the drums, if for no other reason they just look to good sitting there to take back to anyone. As for supplying a drum kit, I wanted a complete stand alone studio that I can offer the young guns for free to get demos done, studio time cost heaps down this end of the world so it also serves us well for practice.

Ty Charly I did a bit of testing and find if I up the min volume level it removes most of the dynamics of the kit as it decreases the range of the drums, this with some EQ and you get that small range hiss instead of the boom (that im starting to like) and it quickly starts sounding like the td6, but blow that I want that big real sound that only a cmos drum kit can do Dave your on the other side of the world and the postage is a killer :-)

[csnow]

Get the VEX kits or go soft-module.

[StuR]

The problem is that your drummer is a clown, not a drummer!

[Fullback32]

Wow....a musician *****ing about someone else in the band buying his stuff....especially something that costs that much! Keep the TD-12 and take back the drummer.

Ok, seriously, I went from a TD-6V to a TD-12. The samples on the 6 are the older ones from the TD-10 and the 12 uses the TD-20s. Now, changing modules that use different sample sets will be weird at first. After playing on a TD-6V for a good three years, I gotta admit that the TD-12 didn't sound "right" at first and wondered if I had made a mistake. My ears were used to the TD-6V. Oddly enough, the sam thing happened when I had upgraded from my Alesis DM5 to the TD-6V...it just didn't sound right! After playing it on the TD-12 for a while, I realized that the TD-12 had much more fidelity not to mention the ability to tweak the sounds to my liking more than the TD-6V did....just as I came to realize that the DM5 wasn't of near the quality of the TD-6V. Just something to consider.

[mystic fred]

the td12 is indeed a big jump up from a td6 - it is a different animal and needs getting used to. if your drummer perseveres and picks up the fine details and nuances the rewards are many

[vjboc]

I had a Roland TD 7 for years and I upgraded to a TD 8. I know it's not as big of a jump as you, But the same thing happened with me. I was so use to the TD 7 , The TD 8 seemed boomy and odd sounding to me. I had to tweak it for few days. I recorded a drum track in a song that we are doing with the TD7. After I got the TD 8 tweaked, I recorded to the same song, But kept the TD 7 track to compare. Now when I listen the song td 8 sounds much better than the TD 7. Not to mention the TD8 is so much more sensitive than the TD 7 (playability).

That would be awesome to have a band mate buy something like that for me.
If you ever need a new drummer ,I am sure you would have a long list from this site.

Play around with that TD 12 for awhile and if you still don't want sell it and buy yourself a Les Paul :-)

Good Luck
Vinny

[Sook]

Well he's come to the party, he's sent me some high quality samples of the drum sounds he likes, the reason I'm hanging this coronation street episode here is I'm a positive bloke and I want this kit to work and I actually like the guy.
Just thinking I could put his samples on the computer and access them via the midi some way, hey worth a try. I checked out the vids and ppl's links here, drummers Rok :-) and seem to be no nonsense fellas. If anyone is in CHCH, NZ then feel free to PM me and I'm perfectly happy with my 30 year old strat :-), since this is looking more like a Coro episode then here's a quick rundown how I got the 12.
They cost about 6 grand new here, I was about to go zzzz at midnight and I saw on a local auction site a pawn broker had it up for 2600 (with the two extra cymbals and kick/all included) I paused for a moment as one would, I thought it was a windup but since it was a shop I offered him 2400 he said yes, I flew up 2 days later, picked it up, packed, it up bought it home. It looks brand new with no scratches, couldn't believe it, checked the serial number, all good. Strangely enough the reserve was 1500 so I pity the guy who had to literally give it away to the shop to feed his family. There is an episode 2 :-) Still going through the links here to see what I can learn but I can see why drummers like drumming, you guys have a huge advantage, you can hear everyone playing and bounce off anyone at anytime, guitarists have melody's running through there head and can easily "miss the point"

[stickinthemud]

Glad your drummer is taking a step back to see the big picture. The TD12 offers so much more than the TD6 - it just isn't as easy an "out of the box" experience as the TD6. The VEX kits make a huge difference, and are well worth the money to save the time tweaking. It's like getting a new instrument of any kind - it will sound different from the one you have, take some adjusting of EQ, and other re-tooling.

If it weren't for the superior features of the TD12, I'd say go back to the TD6 too, but with interval sensing, positional sensing, etc., your drummer would be missing out on a superior playing experience.

I respectfully disagree with Relayer's contemptuous opinion of COSM. "Synth patch" or no, it is the simplest, most user-friendly way to shape drum sounds yet devised, as evidenced by the fact that no other system - module or soft sampler - has access to the wealth of time and effort-saving third-party tweaks (VEX kits, specifically) that the latest Roland modules do.

Sure, if you have the time, ability, and inclination to futz with all the computer gear, MIDI mapping, sound cards, latency issues, etc., a soft module will provide some awesome sounds, but if you want to get down to playing, a module's the way to go, and the TD12 is second only to the TD20 in that regard.

I hear what you are saying about the joys of drumming. Once you lay down the foundation for the band, you have a lot of space to bounce around in (so long as the other players don't try to tell you how to play your instrument). On the other hand, it's not as glamorous as pounding out the licks on the axe, and there's all that crap to haul around!

Love the TD12 - it's your friend!

[Relayer]

I respectfully disagree with Relayer's contemptuous opinion of COSM. "Synth patch" or no, it is the simplest, most user-friendly way to shape drum sounds

Darn, I thought I was gonna get away with it. I really shouldn't have sharpened my point, as my main meaning was that he was comparing apples to apples.

And of course, I respect your respectful disagreement. I played V-drums a loooooong time before I got into VSTs - I've spent 10 x's the hours tweaking my TD-6 back in the day than I have or will ever spend on software. It's just not as hard as people make it out to be. For instance, latency is a complete non-issue if you have the right soundcard - simple as that. I'll grant you that the VEX kits are a vast improvement over the Roland kits, and in a live situation can sound very impressive. But I still play my acoustics a fair amount, and I have to say that even though I'm hitting the same rubber and mesh pads I've always hit, having the sound of a real drum come through the speakers/headphones heightens the experience - it just feels more like the real thing.

Enough thread hijacking. I still say somebody that rants for an hour about a free drumkit has several screws loose.

Cheers

Steve

EDIT: +10 points to the OP for Split Enz