Announcement

Collapse

Lounge Posting Guidelines

The Lounge is for general e-drumming discussion only. Please do not ask product/technical questions. Topics posted incorrectly will be deleted.
See more
See less

How to effectively upgrade a midrange kits snare!

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • How to effectively upgrade a midrange kits snare!

    I'm looking at buying my first e kit mostly because I've stopped playing properly these because as my old housemate used to say, it's the most inconsiderate instrument anyone could play. Which as he lived with me I'd say fair enough.

    So I'm looking for a kit that I can use for practicing and occasional band practice.

    My priority is a kit I can use as close to a real kit as possible, sounds are really not of interest to me as long as it has a midi out. I will be buying this second hand with a budget of 1-1.5k.

    My main issue is I like playing cross-stick as well as rim shots, hence my requirement for a kit I can play like a real kit. Snare and H/H are my main priority where quality is concerned. As long as the toms have a vague accuracy in velocity I'm not overly bothered given it's mostly for practice. I have my starclassic for gigging. I also don't care what they look like, just need pure functionality.

    My main question is, is it possible for me to buy a second hand mid range kit and upgrade the snare with something which can effectively change between cross stick and rim shot and with decent positional sensing, or would I really need to get something like the Td-50 for a properly effective snare.

    I saw a video comparison of the drum-tec pro series and the td-50 snare and it seemed to work just as effectively. So can I use something like this to upgrade a midrange kit effectively and if so how as I can't actually see on drum-tecs website what the output of the snare is and I know the td-50 works via USB and senses the static from the persons hand when using cross stick.

  • #2
    How handy are you with DIY? I reckon if you are going to use midi out to vst as your sound generation a really good option would be to build a megadrum trigger module and DIY pads from a cheap a-kit. If I had the time and your requirements (including budget) this would be my route.

    Comment


    • #3
      "My main issue is I like playing cross-stick as well as rim shots,"
      "second hand with a budget of 1-1.5k."

      So, a Yamaha DTX 7xx series. Sorted.

      No other choice for 3-zone snare. And no horrible bouncy mesh.
      *** Never buy a module without MIDI IN ***
      Yamaha & Roland modules. DTX,TM-2, EC-10m, SP-404. Multi12. TrapKat. ControlPad. Wavedrum. Handsonic. Dynacord RhythmStick. MPC. Paiste 2002/Signatures. Cajons. Djembes. Darbuka. Windsynth. MIDI Bass. Tenori-on. Zoom ARQ. Loads o' synth modules. & some ukes

      Comment


      • #4
        Okay cheers for the advice! So what are the yamaha kits like? I've never played one, how do they compare to the rolands? There's not many second hand in the UK thst I can see. Why is it the rolands are so much more successful given the yamaha does 3 zone triggering at a much lower price point to the roland?

        So the other option would be to use a trigger module with midi out and use that to create my own three zone snare, is that your suggestion? Sorry I'm really not clued up on any e drum technology as this the first time I've ever looked into it.

        Comment


        • #5
          Not many second hand as people tend to keep them.

          Compare? Much better all round. More features, nicer to play. Features like 3-zone pads for nearly 20 years, along with sound layering and switching, sample loading, etc etc. The silicone pads are lovely... this is subjective and only you can decide what you like.

          Roland is "successful" in the same way as people perceive iPhones are "successful", even though they only account for 13% of the world market.

          (disclaimer... I have e-stuff from Yamaha, Roland, Alesis etc etc, and was gigging Roland electronics only last night... No axe to grind here.)

          Ps. Where are you?
          Last edited by electrodrummer; 01-24-19, 09:22 AM.
          *** Never buy a module without MIDI IN ***
          Yamaha & Roland modules. DTX,TM-2, EC-10m, SP-404. Multi12. TrapKat. ControlPad. Wavedrum. Handsonic. Dynacord RhythmStick. MPC. Paiste 2002/Signatures. Cajons. Djembes. Darbuka. Windsynth. MIDI Bass. Tenori-on. Zoom ARQ. Loads o' synth modules. & some ukes

          Comment


          • #6
            The ATV adrums with AD5 module have a built in cross stick feature. I use the ATV snare with Roland BT1 on a Pearl Mimic pro and it is the best system I have had for a 3 zone snare plus realistic feel and sound. I did own a couple of DTX kits and the silicone pads are good. You are limited to a 12 inch size and I thought the impact was a bit firmer/harder than a real drums. The mesh is bouncier although the ATV is close with 3 cones.

            Comment


            • #7
              I live in Nottingham. Well I have to say you've sold yamaha pretty well they should hire you. But I best go have a play in store, then be cheeky and go buy it second hand. Only problem is actually finding one second hand as I scoured the net last night and could find any dtx7xxx kits. A couple of the 502 range cheers. So in your experienced opinion what do you prefer about roland?

              Okay I'm about to go have a read up on the ATV stuff and reply in a second.

              Cheers guys!

              Comment


              • #8
                Well I've been listening to the ATV module and it does actually sound great. But from what I can work out you mean you mount the bt1 to the side of the snare to act as the third zone for cross stick is that right? So the rim on the snare is for rim shots and the bt1 from cross stick? Is this a solution for almost any module?

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Mh5039 View Post
                  Well I've been listening to the ATV module and it does actually sound great. But from what I can work out you mean you mount the bt1 to the side of the snare to act as the third zone for cross stick is that right? So the rim on the snare is for rim shots and the bt1 from cross stick? Is this a solution for almost any module?
                  The Atv snare has a built in crossstick feature that works with the Ad5. I use a Pearl Mimic and need the Bt1 for cross stick with the Atv pad. I used to use the Bt1 on a Pd125 pad and Roland module.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I see, how does the cross stick function work? Is it something which would work with say a yamaha module which offers 3 in 1 triggering? As once I've bought the atv module and snare I'm already over budget as I don't think I'll find one second hand.

                    However it does seem like the bt1 is a good solution to almost all e drum setups. What I can't understand is why manufacturers haven't developed a more simple set up of using two triggers and a simple IF function. IF head is constant pressure and rim triggered, play rim shot, if a quick release of pressure on head when triggered and rim triggered play rim shot. It's not quite as simple as velocity methods but I'm sure it's not overly difficult to do. I'm sure I could programme that with a pressure sensor and an Arduino.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Mh5039 View Post
                      What I can't understand is why manufacturers haven't developed a more simple set up of using two triggers and a simple IF function. IF head is constant pressure and rim triggered, play rim shot, if a quick release of pressure on head when triggered and rim triggered play rim shot..
                      Thing is most drum pads don't register "pressure" as they use piezos as triggers.
                      This could be done using FSRs - and it's this sort of thing that's used in DTX Multi12 and Handsonics (for example) to do bends and mutes and things.
                      Alternate Mode's gear is pretty much all FSR....

                      Yamaha's 3-zones uses a piezo for the head, and two switches (each with a different resistance). The total resistance picked up by the module allows it to simply work out the combination of switches.
                      Last edited by electrodrummer; 01-25-19, 06:57 AM.
                      *** Never buy a module without MIDI IN ***
                      Yamaha & Roland modules. DTX,TM-2, EC-10m, SP-404. Multi12. TrapKat. ControlPad. Wavedrum. Handsonic. Dynacord RhythmStick. MPC. Paiste 2002/Signatures. Cajons. Djembes. Darbuka. Windsynth. MIDI Bass. Tenori-on. Zoom ARQ. Loads o' synth modules. & some ukes

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Well a piezo measures force but will also be able to measure a rate of change of force as the force is proportional to voltage. Hence it can measure acceleration. So it would make sense to me that it would be able to measure a constant force (your hand on the snare when playing cross stick).

                        Well I'm sure there must be reasons otherwise they'd do it! Perhaps the td50 static method is cleaner anyway.

                        But if I could just summise what it think I've worked out with your guys help to make sure I'm on the right lines:

                        The Yamaha DTX 7xx kits would be ideal. Out of interest are there good snare upgrades for the yamaha that work well?

                        A roland BT1 is an effective solution for a Roland kit or possibly alesis kit.

                        ATV module with the ATV snare also works.

                        Anything else I should have taken in here?

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          "Good snare upgrades for the Yamaha...' - not sure I get this? (sorry)
                          *** Never buy a module without MIDI IN ***
                          Yamaha & Roland modules. DTX,TM-2, EC-10m, SP-404. Multi12. TrapKat. ControlPad. Wavedrum. Handsonic. Dynacord RhythmStick. MPC. Paiste 2002/Signatures. Cajons. Djembes. Darbuka. Windsynth. MIDI Bass. Tenori-on. Zoom ARQ. Loads o' synth modules. & some ukes

                          Comment

                          Working...
                          X