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No love from my V-Club hi-hat !

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  • No love from my V-Club hi-hat !

    I've got a new V-Club kit, and I'm using it to trigger samples in Halion, my software sampler that runs as a virtual instrument in Cubase. The sample are Wizoo, and they sound great.

    Here's the problem: Even though I've got 6 or 7 different hi-hat samples within a particular kit (each sound matching different velocities), I can really only hear 2 of them: the "closed hat" and the "open hat". There doesn't seem to be any sensitivity adjustment on the TD-6 when it comes to *opening* the hats, however slowly, and that's making my playing sound weak.

    Any suggestions out there? Is the trouble with Halion or with my TD-6?

    Thanks!
    Dave Keats
    http://www.bandtools.com/dave

  • #2
    The FD-6 does have in-between HH sounds when used on the TD-6. It helps to adjust the pedal itself to full open. I don't know about CC values and don't remember seeing anything about it in the manual. Maybe I can take another look 2nite.

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    • #3
      Could you just try out the Club kit w/o all the extra software? Seems like that might help isolate the problem.
      -Pete

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      • #4
        Sorry, I don't see anything in the manual that's very helpful. I think pjames suggestion is a good one. How well does it work for you when you play the V-Club by itself?

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        • #5
          'till a few days ago, I thought the FD-6 was ON-OFF. When playing around with Tabla #97 - on the TD-6, playing Tom #3 the FD-6 gives cool pitch change.

          I noticed that my FD-6 was miss-adjusted so the the 'in-betweens' almost at the floor (full closed position) Any hints on adjusting the FD-6 range?

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          • #6
            I believe that there's an adjustment on the pedal, not sure about any changes you might be able to make in the software...
            -Pete

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            • #7
              Having not seen an FD6, I'm not sure. But if it is like the FD7, here's what I do. (1) loosen the lug, (2) leave the pedal alone, but press the virtical slider down to the desired depth and (3) tighten the lug.

              What you are adjusting, really, is how far that virtical bar travels from the 'fully closed HH' position upward. If you have it too low you may never really achive a 'fully open HH'. If you have it too high you might not be able to get a 'fully closed HH' - even with the pedal all the way down.

              Trial and error is the name of the game.

              I hope that helps, even if only slightly.
              Last edited by Ranman; 08-15-02, 10:49 AM.
              My website...
              VCustom kit,
              TD8 + Aphex Impulse,
              HDI Cymbals.
              A great site: eDrumming.com

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              • #8
                There is a difference between changes in tone due to velocity crossfading and pedal amount.

                At the basic MIDI level there are two hi-hat sounds - open and closed.

                When the pedal is all the way down the midi note for closed hi-hat is sent. When the pedal is open (by ANY amount in my experience) the midi note sent is for the open hi-hat sound.

                (Okay, I've just remembered that there's three hi-hat sounds in the GM standard. The click from pressing the pedal closed is mapped to yet ANOTHER midi note)

                Velocity crossfading will only respond to the strength of the midi note so you SHOULD be getting some variation on hit-strength in Halion. You can consider this as a one-dimensional variation in the tone.

                The CC message sent when the pedal is moved in between is ignored by most tone modules - in this category Halion falls, even though it's software - but is understood when played back to your drum brain from a sequencer - at least it is on the TD-8 - PROVIDED your sequencer isn't filtering out CC messages it doesn't understand. When the drum-brain uses this value, the SAME hit-strength on the TD for different pedal amounts generates a different sound.

                When combined with velocity related differences of tone this effectively creates a two-dimensional degree of variation, which Halion has no chance of understanding as it is currently set up.

                A lot of drummers depend on changing the tone of the hi-hat with pedal variation - I know I do - and it sounds like this is what you're after.

                I know this doesn't get you any nearer the playing response you want from Halion, but hopefully it might help you understand why you're not there yet.
                - Sean

                TD-8K v1.10 + 2xCY12C/R + 2xKoby Micro Pad

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                • #9
                  Thanks for the good reply seanb

                  This has also been my question too and I do believe the answer is that one can only expect "OPEN" and "CLOSED."

                  I wonder if there any work arounds? I too am in the same boat:

                  I want to use my V-club to sent MIDI to cubase so that I can trigger the same Wizoo samples for the LM4-mkII from Steinberg. Thus far, I can only get open and closed as well.

                  Jeff

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