Welcome! If this is your first visit, you will need to register to participate.

DO NOT use symbols in usernames. Doing so will result in an inability to sign in & post!

If you cannot sign in or post, please visit our Forum Talk section for answers to frequently asked questions.

Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Frankenstein Electronic Drums set?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Frankenstein Electronic Drums set?

    Hello everyone! I am a father to a teenager who wants to learn drums. I play guitar myself so I guess some of my musical genes spilled over to him. Problem is... I don't have much money. I am only receiving half of what my degrees should be worth. And, we live in a townhome... which means that noise is not allowed. The compromise was for him to have an electronic drums set and he can pound all he wants with headsets on.

    In the middle of last year, we got an inexpensive Simmons SD5K. But he already outgrew it and realized its limitations (no rim shots and not so good sounds). I thought that upgrading the kick pad to one that could accommodate double pedals would be good for now. We got a good deal on a Yamaha KP65 and double pedals from ebay. Problem is, it only works if my son double pedals at moderate speeds. If he goes faster, it would just register one beat. However, cochlea advise me to play with the sensitivity knob which I will try later.

    Anyway... I just thought that all my son needs for a satisfactory home practice set is to just upgrade the snare and a good module (brain?). Problem is, I don't know what works with which. May I seek your advice? Or, is this a good idea? If yes, what would be a good affordable module (I think this should be the first to upgrade)? What is a good enough snare pad which can rim shot and all the necessary things (I'm not a drummer. I have no idea what they are)? I would call this a "Frankenstein Set" because it might be a mix up of brands and things that is available and affordable to us. Is this okay?

    Thank you in advance!

  • #2
    If he wants to "learn to play drums" then double kick and rim-shots aren't highest on the list of things to do - I assume he like rwak muzik. The first thing to upgrade if/when you have the money is the module. I don't know where you are in the world, or what sort of budget you have, so can't advise further, but to give up an idea, a second-user Yamaha module could be had for 100 / $150. Then you could start to replace the pads as you need. I use a number of "Frankenstein" kits; mixing and matching is a perfectly reasonable way to go.
    *** MIDI IN: good. Cable snake: bad ***
    Yamaha & Roland modules. DTX,TM-2, EC-10, EC10m, SP-404. Multi12. TrapKat. ControlPads. Octapad, SamplePad, Wavedrum. Handsonic. Dynacord RhythmStick. MPC. Paiste 2002/Signatures. Cajons. Djembes. Darbuka. Windsynth. MIDI Bass. Tenori-on. Zoom ARQ. Synths. Ukes.

    Comment


    • #3
      e.g This: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Yamaha-DTX-V...:SS:SS:GB:1120
      *** MIDI IN: good. Cable snake: bad ***
      Yamaha & Roland modules. DTX,TM-2, EC-10, EC10m, SP-404. Multi12. TrapKat. ControlPads. Octapad, SamplePad, Wavedrum. Handsonic. Dynacord RhythmStick. MPC. Paiste 2002/Signatures. Cajons. Djembes. Darbuka. Windsynth. MIDI Bass. Tenori-on. Zoom ARQ. Synths. Ukes.

      Comment


      • #4
        How much are you looking to spend. Do you already have a decent laptop? You can get a cheap laptop for about $300-400 and any number of free VST such as Drumic'a or MT Power drum kit both of which are free and sound great.

        Check the VST primer on this website. http://www.vdrums.com/forum/advanced...all-vst-primer

        That way you'd have all the awesome sounds that he could want. That won't help with rim shots, but it will definitely improve the sounds. Rim shots aren't necessary and I think it's just a setting issue for double kick.

        Comment


        • #5
          As mentioned, it will depend on your budget. In order....

          Changing the module will help with the sounds, but not by much. What you will get though is more reliable triggering.
          A used Roland TD3 or TD4 or a used Yamaha DTX500 / 502 will get him slightly better sounds, and most importantly, better triggering.

          Then, connecting that module to a computer will improve the sounds drastically. Follow ThePod's suggestions there.

          Finally, picking up a used small kit for cheap, and doing a DIY conversion will feel like Christmas every day to your teenager. Get him involved in the process. He'll be stocked for a long time.
          DTX700, eDRUMin 4+10, A2E Dixon kit, Yamaha cymbals, FSR HH
          Kit Pix http://vdrums.com/forum/album.php?albumid=613

          My new venture, HiEnd Speakers. : voglosounds.com

          Comment


          • #6
            Thank you all for all your advice!

            Would I be able to connects the Simmons SD5K to the computer (he has own in his room) via usb-midi cable to use with a vst? What are the free vst's that you would recommend?

            How much does he want to spend? At the moment, he only has about $120 to spend. He thought that his current purchase of the Yamaha KP65 kick pad and double pedals would suffice for now and he feels bad because he did a great deal of saving up for it and only to find out that it does not work on his current set up.

            The seller where we bought the KP65 is offering the following:
            Yamaha DTExpress @ $98.95: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Yamaha-DTXpr...item2edefb6758
            Yamaha DTExplorer @ $109.95: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Yamaha-DTXpl...item2edf1df219
            Yamaha DTX500 @ $139.95: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Yamaha-DTX50...item5d56c79941

            Naturally, I am interested in the Yamaha DTExpress @ $98.95 because it is the least cost. Is this ok? If not, which one would you suggest? And, would his current simmons pads and harness work on it?

            Thank you!

            Comment


            • #7
              The KP65 should work it should be able to handle double bass at any speed. It's got to be a set up thing in the module. If his computer is decent then it should work fine for VSTs. A midi to USB cable is exactly what he needs. If he's running windows you should get the ASIOforall drivers. Read the sticky on VSTs I linked to above. Before you buy anything have him download either of the two VST's I listed. Drumic'a or MT Power drum kit both of which are free (google is your friend).

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by littlebadboy View Post
                Thank you all for all your advice!

                Would I be able to connects the Simmons SD5K to the computer (he has own in his room) via usb-midi cable to use with a vst? What are the free vst's that you would recommend?

                How much does he want to spend? At the moment, he only has about $120 to spend. He thought that his current purchase of the Yamaha KP65 kick pad and double pedals would suffice for now and he feels bad because he did a great deal of saving up for it and only to find out that it does not work on his current set up.

                The seller where we bought the KP65 is offering the following:
                Yamaha DTExpress @ $98.95: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Yamaha-DTXpr...item2edefb6758
                Yamaha DTExplorer @ $109.95: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Yamaha-DTXpl...item2edf1df219
                Yamaha DTX500 @ $139.95: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Yamaha-DTX50...item5d56c79941

                Naturally, I am interested in the Yamaha DTExpress @ $98.95 because it is the least cost. Is this ok? If not, which one would you suggest? And, would his current simmons pads and harness work on it?

                Thank you!
                The Express is cool, yes. I'd prefer the DTV v2.0 that I posted the link to, but it seems the seller has pulled that one. The Simmons pads will work with it (single zone, I'm assuming). If you want rimshots, you'll need a dual-zone pad. Again, as I said, above, if he's learning, forget about all the "clever" stuff (e.g. VSTs etc.) - he'll just get frustrated with the technology whilst you're on a budget.
                *** MIDI IN: good. Cable snake: bad ***
                Yamaha & Roland modules. DTX,TM-2, EC-10, EC10m, SP-404. Multi12. TrapKat. ControlPads. Octapad, SamplePad, Wavedrum. Handsonic. Dynacord RhythmStick. MPC. Paiste 2002/Signatures. Cajons. Djembes. Darbuka. Windsynth. MIDI Bass. Tenori-on. Zoom ARQ. Synths. Ukes.

                Comment


                • #9
                  That "technology" is very simple for kids these days... they were born in the digital age. Contrary to many here who were born when TVs were black and white still...

                  I wouldn't turn away from VSTs. It is not so difficult. Actually, they are the reason why I continued my venture into e-drums. I was getting bored with module's sounds and would have quit e-drumming, but VSTs rekindled my spark for quiet electronic kits.

                  For the kick problems, try to play with pad sensitivity and pad rejection settings in the module. It should be possible to fix a bit of it.
                  DTX700, eDRUMin 4+10, A2E Dixon kit, Yamaha cymbals, FSR HH
                  Kit Pix http://vdrums.com/forum/album.php?albumid=613

                  My new venture, HiEnd Speakers. : voglosounds.com

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    My comment on VSTs, is that is people are on a very tight budget - as the OP is - they're gonna end up in a heap of annoyance with latency etc. It (could) be a distraction from the core learning of the instrument.
                    *** MIDI IN: good. Cable snake: bad ***
                    Yamaha & Roland modules. DTX,TM-2, EC-10, EC10m, SP-404. Multi12. TrapKat. ControlPads. Octapad, SamplePad, Wavedrum. Handsonic. Dynacord RhythmStick. MPC. Paiste 2002/Signatures. Cajons. Djembes. Darbuka. Windsynth. MIDI Bass. Tenori-on. Zoom ARQ. Synths. Ukes.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I think my son is dead set on the DTXpress. It is within range of his budget at little bit less than $100. Any comments on it? Is it a good replacement for our crappy Simmons SD5K? Are the sounds almost like the real thing? Or... should this be on a different thread?

                      Not ruling out vst yet. We have a midi cable and I'll play with it later. I am somewhat familiar latency and ASIOs from working with my DAW.

                      Thanks everyone! You have all been informative and kind!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Hi.

                        You've already asked this.

                        Let me re-iterate.

                        The DTXpress is better than the Simmons. The DTXpress v1 was a CUT DOWN version of the DTX Pro v2 which I recommended (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Yamaha-DTX-V...-/161645095557) instead (hence being called "xpress", rather than "pro"). If you can find the Pro, and you're on a budget, then buy that - it has over 1,000 sounds. You will probably need a Yamaha hi-hat controller to work 100% with the Yamaha module. The Simmons pads will work as single zone pads , with a little tweaking on the module. I've had all sorts of pads plugged into Yamaha modules with no issues.

                        This one was sold for $74!!! http://www.ebay.com/itm/Yamaha-DTX-V...item1e9a0a72bc
                        *** MIDI IN: good. Cable snake: bad ***
                        Yamaha & Roland modules. DTX,TM-2, EC-10, EC10m, SP-404. Multi12. TrapKat. ControlPads. Octapad, SamplePad, Wavedrum. Handsonic. Dynacord RhythmStick. MPC. Paiste 2002/Signatures. Cajons. Djembes. Darbuka. Windsynth. MIDI Bass. Tenori-on. Zoom ARQ. Synths. Ukes.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I don't think there will be a huge improvement on the sounds. That module is pretty old, it will sound electronic and machine gun pretty hard. Plus, as it was mentioned, your HH controller will not work with a Yamaha module. So expect more money to get that working. The cheapest HH controller is DIY of course, would cost about $20 in parts, but there is a little work to be done. It's not just plug and play, it will need some soldering.

                          As for better sounds, let me mention again, VSTs are the way to go. Nothing in the price range you are looking will bring a smile on your son's face.
                          DTX700, eDRUMin 4+10, A2E Dixon kit, Yamaha cymbals, FSR HH
                          Kit Pix http://vdrums.com/forum/album.php?albumid=613

                          My new venture, HiEnd Speakers. : voglosounds.com

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by perceval View Post
                            Finally, picking up a used small kit for cheap, and doing a DIY conversion will feel like Christmas every day to your teenager. Get him involved in the process. He'll be stocked for a long time.
                            I second this. Yes, upgrade the module to whatever you can, but after that, instead of saving up and shelling out for new kitpieces (this will inevitably happen), dive into the DIY section and you'll see that making your own conversion with a cheap acoustic kit (or pad by pad) can actually be quite easy - and if you're on a budget, much cheaper than buying e-pads. Plus, your kid will learn loads about how it all works.
                            Megadrum module, DIY A2E pads, DIY 2 & 3-zone cymbals, DIY hall-effect 3-zone hi-hat, El Cheapo buttkicker, DIY trigger beaters on DIY longboard/direct drive modded pedals. DIY IEMs. Some kit pics/history.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by electrodrummer View Post
                              Hi.

                              You've already asked this.

                              Let me re-iterate.

                              The DTXpress is better than the Simmons. The DTXpress v1 was a CUT DOWN version of the DTX Pro v2 which I recommended (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Yamaha-DTX-V...-/161645095557) instead (hence being called "xpress", rather than "pro"). If you can find the Pro, and you're on a budget, then buy that - it has over 1,000 sounds. You will probably need a Yamaha hi-hat controller to work 100% with the Yamaha module. The Simmons pads will work as single zone pads , with a little tweaking on the module. I've had all sorts of pads plugged into Yamaha modules with no issues.

                              This one was sold for $74!!! http://www.ebay.com/itm/Yamaha-DTX-V...item1e9a0a72bc

                              I apologize. I didn't understand your previously as I didn't really read it well. Thank you for your advice! I will wait until a good deal on a DTX version 2 comes by.

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X