Yamaha and the KP65

[Bighouse]

I'm looking forward to buying a new kit soon. I was pretty much set on the Yamaha DTX700k, and i love the TCS pads. It seems like such a great kit.... but then the bass drum. The KP65 kick pad seems so cheap and unlike the feel of an acoustic. Also it seems to make a very loud slap when hit. Very dissapointing :'(

Because of this i am considering the 2 box instead (sounds great!), however I have heard of some issues with hi hat response as well as overall build quality. Also, i find mesh heads to be quite springy, and this is the reason i have decided to not go for a roland.

If anyone has any advice on which they believe is the better kit overall, i would appreciate it greatly. I believe the yamaha is better overall, so do i have any options in terms of reducing kick pad noise and/or improving feel? Maybe eventually swap it for the KP125?

Thanks in advance for any advice you can offer on these two kits and the KP65

[Tommy_D]

I would forget buying the 700 and pick up this used set of 900 pads:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/YAMAHA-DTX-9...item3aa22197ce

And this used 900 module:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Yamaha-DTXtr...item1c4d916fe6

$2400 out the door for a DTX900 kit.

[grog]

I can't comment on 2Box, I can on the DTX stuff and the TCS pads. I believe user perceval has a DTX700 so can opine specifically about that.

Keep in mind that a fair number of drummers from an acoustic background feel that upright rubber kicks like the KP65 are closer to acoustic than let's say mesh which just about everyone agrees is really bouncy. Now if you like a bouncy kick...

I've bounced back and forth between a mesh kick and a rubber kick (KP65 and Simmons, there's no appreciable difference in response between the two) for the last 3 years now and while the feel is different and you need to adjust, it's not been as jarring as I thought.

But, that's me and I'm a big believe in getting the right edrum gear to fit your particular style, etc., and not depend on everybody else to say "such and such is the *only* choice for you.".

Currently I'm using my Hart 8" Acupad kick, yes, it's mesh. The "problem" with moving away from the KP65 is that you lose that extra input that's chained to it. Maybe this won't be a problem for you with a DTX700 kit but for me on a DTX502, I needed that extra input. No problem, I use a splitter and run seperate cables from the Kick input on the module. You can do the same. It's taken me a while to dial in the Acupad but it's been fine once that occurred.

Bear in mind that the KP125 is discountinued and I've not seen any announcement by Yamaha about it's replacement. And I rarely ever see em for sale used although the DTXperience site would be a better place to ask around for it.

Another affordable option would be from Pintech:
http://pintechworld.com/shop/gig-kd/

I've not banged on a Concertcast in years but it should work fine.

Perhaps you should shop around for a used mesh kick. A quick check on ebay reveals nothing from Hart, not surprising so I entered this search term

Roland KD*

and found the usual slew of highly priced Roland mesh kicks but scattered in there are a few that won't break the bank and, with a splitter, could be your permament solution over the KP125.

Or go beaterless ala the Triggera Krigg or any of the others we reviewed at digitalDrummer Mag:
http://issuu.com/digitaldrummer/docs...vember_2013_lr

Hope this helps.

www.digitaldrummermag.com
www.dauphinehotel.com

[grog]

Or what Tommy said.



www.digitaldrummermag.com
www.dauphinehotel.com

[Bighouse]

I would forget buying the 700 and pick up this used set of 900 pads:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/YAMAHA-DTX-9...item3aa22197ce

And this used 900 module:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Yamaha-DTXtr...item1c4d916fe6

$2400 out the door for a DTX900 kit.

I would love to do that so much. Unfortunately I live in the UK and it would seem used electric kits (especially yamaha's) are pretty hard to find

[Bighouse]

Thanks grog!
So a kick pad like the KP65 is actually better than a mesh head in terms of likeness to an acoustic, that's interesting. In that case i'm happy to go with the rubber as opposed to mesh, but may look into some used mesh as you say.

Other than that, the only way to reduce noise of kick pad i guess would be to use a felt beater? Any other solutions? (not that sound is a massive issue, but would like to be quite if possible)
I'm very close to buying the 700k now. Anymore advice on either of these kits from anyone would be greatly appreciated!

[electrodrummer]

I like my KP65s Feel great to me. (and I've been doing this for a very long time)

[perceval]

I like my 700. If I were going DIY pads again, I would choose the 502, but if you are going with the TCS pads, then the 700 is a good choice. It's fun to have the sliders. But I have mostly moved to VSTs now.

If the KP65 is too loud for you, the Triggera is a pretty good trigger.

Also, be sure to go to digitaldrummer, find the code to download the PHX kit from Yamaha. It sounds very good.

There's also DTX tools, which is an app to configure your kits from a computer instead of navigating through menus on the module. Pretty nice.

Happy drumming!

[Bighouse]

Thanks for the replies
The triggera seems worth a look, but the KP65 should be fine. Seems like the Yamaha is the best option for my budget then. (And thanks for the tips perceval)

[jpsquared482]

I've used mesh (KD140 and a DIY that I've tweaked to my liking) and rubber (KD8) and fabric (KD9). I also have the new Roland KT-10 reverse beater.

Yup, the mesh pads are a bit bouncy. If you bury the beater, you're ok, but if you play jazz style (release off the head) the bounce can be a bit much. The KD140 is a great kick pad; feel is good but it still bounced more than I liked, but I got used to it. I built a better foam setup with my DIY, to my liking anyway. It consists of a sandwich of two stiffer (charcoal gray dense foam) with a spongy memory foam layer in between. This internal pad is about 8" in diameter and is directly behind the beater. The Quartz trigger is mounted about 1/2 way between that and the shell. I use this kick for live settings for look. I've even used it in combination with my KD-7 (below), meaning the DIY kick is for looks. The KD-7 is my actual trigger. No one knows but me.

The KD9 gets a lot of good reviews, and I like that pad. I just wish it were more stable/rigid. I'm not fond of the look; it's too "toy-like". Feel is very good. I actually prefer the feel to the KD140.

The KT-10 is a great concept because it is a pedal and a pad in one; build quality is great. Its one drawback is ironically the fact that it is also the pedal, so if you do don't like the feel, it's not for you. It is adjustable, but there are only two spring settings. Roland should have designed an infinitely adjustable spring like all normal pedals have. I like the feel overall. It is extremely quiet.

After all this experimenting, my favorite pedal is still the Roland KD-7 with an inverse beater on a rubber pad. It lacks bounce and triggers very predictably with great dynamic range. You get to use your own pedal, which is a plus over the KT-10. And if you buy right, you can get a refurbished one for about $80. I got two at RMC Audio Direct at that price.

Hope this helps.

[Jovato]

The one good thing about the KP65 which is seldom mentioned, is that it is a perfect size to have 2 bass drum triggers for true double bass. If you use your hi-hat pedal a lot, it can feel way more natural to have a bass drum on the outside of the hi-hat (without a slave pedal bar running across it). Double pedals are incredibly convenient, but I always felt they compromised my hi-hat position. That said, the KP-65 is the cheapest part of the kit. If you don't like it, you are not out much money replacing it with whatever kick trigger you want. They will all work. If you do like it, you could buy a second KP-65 and another single pedal for less than the cost of the bigger kick pads from Yamaha, Roland etc.

[electrodrummer]

Also worthy of note is that the KP65 has an input on it for adding an additional trigger pad to your kit.....

[Bighouse]

Ok so i've found a deal on the Yamaha for £200 less than anywhere else (£1500 instead of £1750) but it's a demo model. Would you guys suggest going for the demo model to save the money as long as it is in good condition, or just go brand new?

[grog]

Demo all the way. The vast majority of my edrum gear over the years has been purchased used. I'm a big believer in going that route.

www.digitaldrummermag.com
www.dauphinehotel.com

[electrodrummer]

^-- agreed. Demo or or second-hand is fine :-)