Best 2Box HiHat Setup?

[jpsquared482]

Hi guys/gals,

I'm loving my Roland/VST setup but think I'd rather convert to 2box. The problem is - I think I'll really miss my VH-13. From what I've read here and elsewhere is that the 2box can be made to closely achieve the articulation of the VH13, but won't match it. Maybe that's a firmware/software thing inside the 2box? For you 2Box experts out there who have spent some time "perfecting" your hihat response/feel/playability, which of the following do you feel is the best way to go and what have you done to perfect your hats on the 2box?

1) Get the 2Box hihat. It's as good as the VH13 if set up correctly (Is this true first of all, and what have you done to get it that good?)
2) Get the Stealth 2Box HH stand conversion kit and a Yamaha PCY135 or other cymbal.
3) Something other than the above?
4) Use the VH13 and internal hats of the TD30 but trigger VSTs for the drums and cymbals. Set up a kit on the TD30 that mutes everything except the hihats. Mute the hihat sound in the the VST kit. Blend the two outputs in a mixer. (This is what I'm doing now.)

#4 works well but seems overkill in terms of hardware, and yes there is still minor latency even though the TD-30's use of USB MIDI to/from the computer and generating sound in the TD30 does a good job of reducing latency. If I can get that to zero and achieve VH13 hihat performance quality out of a 2box, that would be ideal! Also, I'd like to keep things simpler and not use a laptop and TD-30, particularly for live performances.


Thanks!

[JmanWord]

Just a FYI: You can use the VH-13 Hi Hat with the 2Box module if you also use the Stealth 2Box HH stand conversion kit. One TRS cable goes from the 2Box module Hi Hat jack to the Module input of the Stealth conversion box. The other TRS cable goes from the trigger output jack of the VH-13 to the Cymbal input of the Stealth conversion box. In this way the "Box" takes the place of the controller of the VH-13 using the VH-13 cymbal as the HH of the 2Box module.

Not to try and sway the direction you choose ..... I just wanted to clarify that the conversion kit is for using other brand electronic cymbals with the 2Box module, and that includes cymbals like the VH-11, 12, 13 as well as CY-5, 6, 8, just to name a few. Yamaha cymbals might need slight modification as mentioned in Manfred's thread at the 2Box forum here: http://www.2box-forum.com/index.php?topic=1010.0 I actually started building these to make my own Stealth HH cymbal conversion kit compatible for use with the 2Box module, but almost any E cymbal can be used. Additionally .... There is a knob on the side of the conversion box that is adjustable to trim the signal in case a cymbal is "too hot". So as I say most e cymbals will work.
Hope it helps, J

[fulrmr(Daniel)]

To add to Jman's comment the top pad of the VH-13 is the only part that works as the controller portion will not work with the 2Box thus the need for the control box mod. I did this too when I had my VH-13 and TD-30. Will you be keeping the TD-30? If so you can combine both the TD-30 sounds and 2Box VSTs at a console using a splitter from the top pad once you have the control box installed. If you are ditching the 30/VH-13 to procure the cash then the other options are well documented in various threads.

Personally I would buy the box from Jman and find a 3rd party pad and really nice HH stand that I like rather than mucking with the VH-13.

http://www.vdrums.com/forum/advanced/diy/62492-2box-gear-compatibility-and-mods-links-and-builds

http://www.vdrums.com/forum/advanced/diy/66690-2box-hh-control-box-mod-questions

http://www.vdrums.com/forum/advanced/diy/66755-vh-13-2box-hybrid-remote-hh-conversion

[jpsquared482]

Hi guys!

Nice to hear from the experts on this one! Just to be clear, what I'm looking for is how to get the best performance out of the 2box, but not use the VH13 in doing that. My #4 option was listed as that's what I'm doing now when I want the best HH experience using VSTs. As Daniel suggested, I'd be selling the TD30 and VH13 to go this route.

So, it appears your advice is to get the Jman conversion box, use my HH stand (a top level Gibraltar is what I'm using with the VH13, and I like its feel) along with a Roland pad (not a Yamaha).

Then, the question for now is: will I get close to the same HH experience as I do now with the TD30 with either the Jman Box and a CY8 OR the stock 2Box HH's? I've heard Daniel say in various threads that the TD30/VH13 is effectively the gold standard for HH performance, but what's the best system to get close to that in a 2Box setup? I'm looking for smooth open/closed variability, good foot chicks & splashes, as well as 2-zone if possible.

Also, nice to see the forum start to breathe new life now that it's ticking along much better!

Thanks again!

John

[ThePod]

I will offer another solution. I've not done this but the word on the net seems to be that the Gen 16 hi-hats have very authentic feel. You could be pick up a DCP and just a Gen 16 set of hats and use that with your standard hi-hat pedal. It would for sure give you the best feel and the sound can be tailored to your liking.

[fulrmr(Daniel)]

I will offer another solution. I've not done this but the word on the net seems to be that the Gen 16 hi-hats have very authentic feel. You could be pick up a DCP and just a Gen 16 set of hats and use that with your standard hi-hat pedal. It would for sure give you the best feel and the sound can be tailored to your liking.

I use these now and "authentic" is quite correct because they are "real" acoustic hats that perform at a fraction of the volume level. However if "virtually quite" play is needed...these wont do it. They are still acoustic hats and should only be considered if a "lower" volume than acoustic is needed. Rubber is much much quieter. BTW...the Buffed Bronze series will have much warmer tones than the Nickel.

That said....Jman sells a trigger kit also that can be used to allow these to trigger the samples on the 2Box when paired with his control box. A2E cymbals (of any kind) are still not as quiet as rubber, however these will feel much better than a traditional A2E as you do not need to apply the thick clear PVC dampening material to the underside to control the noise level and vibrations once the trigger is installed. This allows the cymbal to maintain most of the traditional playing characteristics and feel of A Hats.

To address the the playability of the 2Box hats in general(in my case the control box) I feel that with the correct stand and sample pool loaded, the 2Box is every bit as good as the TD-30/VH-13. YMMV.

Oh...and do yourself a favor and DON'T use a CY-8. Although theoretically compatible with the 2Box...it's design is plagued with a history of faults and defects and there are so many better choices out there.

[jpsquared482]

Thanks, Guys,

I have tried Gen16's and they're a great concept. I just prefer the quiet approach all around for my ekit, due to family issues so it's rubber for me. Daniel, thanks for your encouragement about the ability to achieve great playability (every bit as good as VH13's) with the correct stand and samples. I have what I feel is a rock sold Gibraltar HH stand. Can you recommend particular samples you like that achieve great articulation from open to closed and smooth in-betweens? For the pad should I just use a CY12 instead of the CY8. I have one of those already.