Help....I can't take my TD3 sounds anymore!

[BadThad]

OK, I admit....I'm a eKit noob....I need some help. The sounds on this TD3 are just completely subpar. I'm going to do some recording and I need this kit to "sound" better.

From what little I understand thus far, I'm going to need a good midi card and some software that will allow my TD3 to basically function as triggers to midi events. I think I'm going to start with this M-Audio card (unless there's something better in this price range):

http://www.zzounds.com/item--MDOAP2496

Once I get that, what's the cheapest/best software for me to trigger and record? I need some software with a decent range of drum sounds....something that will make me happy.

Thanks

EDIT - I just bought this card, seems much better than the 2496:

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/produ...ace?sku=703610

Just need someone to point me to the software. I hope I'm making the correct assumption....that I can remap the sounds for recording with this card and software! Please tell me I don't need to buy more hardware like an Alesis. LOL This all purely for recording, no playing out....or I'd buy a real eKit.

[BadThad]

Is it alright to buy this software "used"? I just can't get updates I guess:

eBay

[csnow]

I wouldnt buy any of the drum software used. Most of the companies have very strict licensing and dont allow transfer; however, you can always contact their support department and ask. Look at Superior 2.0 by toontracks.

[BadThad]

I wouldnt buy any of the drum software used. Most of the companies have very strict licensing and dont allow transfer; however, you can always contact their support department and ask. Look at Superior 2.0 by toontracks.

Yea, I was looking at Drummer Superior 2.0, but the list price is $349. If I spend $80 on DFH used, then I can qualify for the upgrade which is only $129...that would save me $140.

Does anyone know how the upgrade verification works with Drummer Superior? Most programs simply scan the hard drive for the qualifying product or ask you to insert your orginal CD.

Anyone else willing to offer some words of wisdom for me? I still haven't heard anyone confirm that I'm even on the correct path.

[BadThad]

I guess I'm on my own. Nobody like noobs around here? I'll just keep fishing for some advice/help:

I built a dedicated music PC yesterday and installed my new Audiophile 192 card. I also ordered EZdrummer, but it's not here yet. All I have ATM is Live 7.0.7 to work with, which is a bit overwhelming. I started on the tutorial last night, I have a LOT to learn. I've connnected my TD-3 to the midi in on the 192 card, but I'm stuck with figuring out the input selections in Live. Note: I have disabled the integrated sound on the PC to avoid any conflits and to minimize my confusion. Was this the right thing to do or is it OK to enable my integrated sound?

Now, some questions about Live. In the Preferences window, I have two driver types: MME/DirectX and ASIO. I'm assuming that I need to use ASIO. What is that an acronym for? Audio Source In/Out? When I select MME/DirectX, my audio input and output devices default to "M-Audio Delta AP-192 1/2DX". When I select ASIO, I only have one "Audio Device "M-Audio Delta ASIO". Which one should I use for MIDI input? Can I mix analog inputs with MIDI inputs? At some point, I'd like to be able to record my drums in MIDI and two guitars with analog at the same time, possible?

When I click on "Audio Setup", it takes me to the driver mixer screen mixer inputs, on that screen I don't have MIDI as an option. Why is that? Also, my master volume sliders are "grayed out" and I can't use them, how come?

[gmbydmit]

well, you're kinda right....sometimes the newbies don't get a quick response on things. Anyhow, I'm far far far from any kinda expert on any of this stuff....I'm just the friggin drummer, Man!

One little bit of advice....look for postings by Joe K, Bar T, jrcel, Michael Render, etc,etc (there are way too many great helpful folks on this forum to mention everyone who's helped me).....these guys ARE the experts.

I use Sonar HS6 in my PC with an M-Audio Delta 1010LT sound card....kinda similar to what you are using. I HAVE been using the 'M-Audio Delta Asio' drivers, and everything seems to be working fine....Midi in/out, audio in/out.

I personally, using just what I have, and using Sonar for mixing, editing, etc have recorded, my V-Drums audio and midi, with vocals, 2 guitars, and a bassist all at the same time...just for a half ass demo for the band....for half ass, it didn't turn out too bad IMO.

examples available upon request (yeah right!)

my home studio is alot like my golfing...if I hit under 100 cool! In the mean time, I'll just keep hacking and learning.

keep the faith, Brother!

[Sabre]

I guess I'm on my own. Nobody like noobs around here?

At 88 posts, I wouldn't think you'd be considered noob...

Personally, I think the lack of response is due to the specific nature of your questions. If someone doesn't have direct experience with your specific setup, any response would be purely speculation. I've found there are 2 very good reasons people don't respond in these forums. One - they don't know the answer (or have nothing relevant/helpful to say). Two - the question has been answered several times before. A good FAQ section would be very helpful, and the search engine here is notoriously difficult to master. Not to mention I once got my ass handed to me for suggesting the ASIO4ALL driver was the issue, but thats another story...

I don't record and I'm no expert either, but I have experimented with EZ Dummer, Addictive Drums, VSTHost, and Ableton Live. I use an M-Audio UNO USB device and the ASIO4ALL driver with my PC's onboard audio.

As far as the volume sliders, the plug-ins have their own mixer volume sliders, so I can only assume the sliders are greyed out because you don't have a plug-in loaded, so there is really nothing to control. As far as the software licensing and upgrade questions, or anything to do with recording, I'd have to defer to someone more experienced.

This all purely for recording, no playing out....or I'd buy a real eKit.

Some of us TD-3 owners might take offense to that statement...

For what it's worth, I keep going back to the stock TD-3 sounds. The plug-ins are nice but they take a lot of time & effort learning the programs, mapping midi events, & playing around with sounds. And every time I go back to stock, I find myself thinking the sounds are awesome, and for what I need the hassle isn't worth it. I eventually plan to upgrade my module, and if I was ever to take an interest in recording or "playing out" as it were, that would be the first thing I'd do. Second would be getting some VEX kits to go with it...

[JrummerJ]

badTHad,

Are you going to be recording or do you just want to hear better samples while you are playing/practicing. If you don't really care about recording that much, just wait until you get EZdrummer and then register and download Toontrack Solo for hosting EZdrummer (and maybe Superior 2.0 eventually!). It is dead easy, and easily allows you to run multiple instances of EZD if you want more cymbals, etc.

The midi and audio setup in Solo are very obvious and you should be uo and running quickly once you have that and EZD installed.

J

[BadThad]

well, you're kinda right....sometimes the newbies don't get a quick response on things. Anyhow, I'm far far far from any kinda expert on any of this stuff....I'm just the friggin drummer, Man!

One little bit of advice....look for postings by Joe K, Bar T, jrcel, Michael Render, etc,etc (there are way too many great helpful folks on this forum to mention everyone who's helped me).....these guys ARE the experts.

I use Sonar HS6 in my PC with an M-Audio Delta 1010LT sound card....kinda similar to what you are using. I HAVE been using the 'M-Audio Delta Asio' drivers, and everything seems to be working fine....Midi in/out, audio in/out.

I personally, using just what I have, and using Sonar for mixing, editing, etc have recorded, my V-Drums audio and midi, with vocals, 2 guitars, and a bassist all at the same time...just for a half ass demo for the band....for half ass, it didn't turn out too bad IMO.

examples available upon request (yeah right!)

my home studio is alot like my golfing...if I hit under 100 cool! In the mean time, I'll just keep hacking and learning.

keep the faith, Brother!

I hear ya! I'm just a drummer, not an engineer....but I'm a pretty smart guy, I do have a BS degree in Chemistry, however I'm totally ignorant to all this eKit stuff. Happily, ignorance can be "cured" and that's why I'm hear begging for some help.

I have searched this forum inside out and upside down. Unfortunately, the vast majority of what I've found is more advanced and not much is taylored to the TD-3 nor the Audiophile 192. So, the pleading and begging will continue. Afterall, I believe this is the #1 forum for edrumming in the world.

[BadThad]

At 88 posts, I wouldn't think you'd be considered noob...

Personally, I think the lack of response is due to the specific nature of your questions. If someone doesn't have direct experience with your specific setup, any response would be purely speculation. I've found there are 2 very good reasons people don't respond in these forums. One - they don't know the answer (or have nothing relevant/helpful to say). Two - the question has been answered several times before. A good FAQ section would be very helpful, and the search engine here is notoriously difficult to master. Not to mention I once got my ass handed to me for suggesting the ASIO4ALL driver was the issue, but thats another story...

I don't record and I'm no expert either, but I have experimented with EZ Dummer, Addictive Drums, VSTHost, and Ableton Live. I use an M-Audio UNO USB device and the ASIO4ALL driver with my PC's onboard audio.

As far as the volume sliders, the plug-ins have their own mixer volume sliders, so I can only assume the sliders are greyed out because you don't have a plug-in loaded, so there is really nothing to control. As far as the software licensing and upgrade questions, or anything to do with recording, I'd have to defer to someone more experienced.


Some of us TD-3 owners might take offense to that statement...

For what it's worth, I keep going back to the stock TD-3 sounds. The plug-ins are nice but they take a lot of time & effort learning the programs, mapping midi events, & playing around with sounds. And every time I go back to stock, I find myself thinking the sounds are awesome, and for what I need the hassle isn't worth it. I eventually plan to upgrade my module, and if I was ever to take an interest in recording or "playing out" as it were, that would be the first thing I'd do. Second would be getting some VEX kits to go with it...

Well, I guess most of my posts are a waste of cyberspace! LOL You can see I've been a member here a pretty long time, most of that has been reading and searching the forum. I think I've paid my dues, I'm not just here wanting someone to completely hold my hand. I have made a serious effort to gather the information I desire, but there's little to be had in relation to my specific questions.

I understand about the VEX kits, and I may look into that at some point. For now, I just want to at least get the MIDI part working. I've read though the TD-3 manual and followed what it said, so getting the MIDI to output is quite simple (hold down INST and power the unit on). My problem is getting the proper settings and Ableton to work with the input.

Thanks for the response...I'm starting to feel not completely invisible! LOL

[BadThad]

badTHad,

Are you going to be recording or do you just want to hear better samples while you are playing/practicing. If you don't really care about recording that much, just wait until you get EZdrummer and then register and download Toontrack Solo for hosting EZdrummer (and maybe Superior 2.0 eventually!). It is dead easy, and easily allows you to run multiple instances of EZD if you want more cymbals, etc.

The midi and audio setup in Solo are very obvious and you should be uo and running quickly once you have that and EZD installed.

J

I'm going to be recording. My goal is to practice in silence with my bass and guitar players and to do some internet collab work. I'd like to run my drums, bass and guitar into the Audiophile 192, then go out to my board, then into my Art 406 headphone amp.

For now, I just want to get this dang MIDI thing to work so I can at least test my new Audiophile card. Oh well, EZdrummer is on the way and, from what I've read, it has a specific MIDI input setting for the TD-3.....which should take care of a lot of my current frustration.

Thanks for the response!

[daveybabes]

I've just set up Ableton Live lite, placed some funky samples in to make a scene, made 3 scenes, gone from TD12 to Edirol Audio Capture UA20 midi interface to laptop and set the cymbals up to trigger the scenes via midi, no probs ... just wondering why ya having so many probs.?.

In Ableton i went to options then preferences and saw the Edirol UA20 on the list and chose it (asio drivers) and that was it. The TD3 sends midi just like most modules out so it should work, when i hit something on he TD12 the blue midi light on Ableton lights up showing midi messages are going through.

Then i clicked midi on the Ableton and chose which things i wanted to trigger and hit a cymbal on the kit, job done.
I launch them 2 bars in advance and can jam along.

[BadThad]

I've just set up Ableton Live lite, placed some funky samples in to make a scene, made 3 scenes, gone from TD12 to Edirol Audio Capture UA20 midi interface to laptop and set the cymbals up to trigger the scenes via midi, no probs ... just wondering why ya having so many probs.?.

In Ableton i went to options then preferences and saw the Edirol UA20 on the list and chose it (asio drivers) and that was it. The TD3 sends midi just like most modules out so it should work, when i hit something on he TD12 the blue midi light on Ableton lights up showing midi messages are going through.

Then i clicked midi on the Ableton and chose which things i wanted to trigger and hit a cymbal on the kit, job done.
I launch them 2 bars in advance and can jam along.

Let me just show you what I'm seeing.

In M-Audio Delta Control Panel and from Live:

[Sabre]

Here are my Live midi settings. It appears the only one that matters is Input Track On.

For what it's worth, I can only hear the audio through my PC. I can hear no sound when listening through the headphones attached to my module. That said, once the VST plug-in is loaded, I can not only hear the audio through my PC headphones, but I can see the trigger response in the volume sliders in Live as demonstrated in the second image attached.

I hope this helps a little.

[daveybabes]

So you are saying that you have installed the Audiophile 192 card which is a soundcard and midi interface from what i see?

But when you select "asio" in the preferences for midi devices the option is the "M audio Delta" which is another device completely?

So u have 2 cards installed ? Is this M audio Delta also a midi and audio interface?

Sorry im no expert, but if you uninstall the M audio device and just reinstall the Audiophile 192 which is ideal for Ableton with audio and midi inputs/outputs and make sure you install the asio low latency drivers that came with the card and then try again on Ableton.

Then when you select asio in the preferences you should see the Audiophile 192.

I have a simple set up, Roland module - midi out (to) midi cable (to) Edirol UA20 midi in (midi audio interface, asio drivers installed with device) (to) USB cable (to) Laptop with vista and Ableton.

The preferences give me MME/DirectX or asio, "i choose asio" cos i think the direct x is my laptops card so i avoid that.

After choosing asio everything is fine.

SABRE - I have always used Ableton, since Ableton Live 2 - it does everything and is fab, i don't see a need for cubase or cakewalk etc unless i was a pro set up, Ableton beats the lot! superb on samples - easy to assign triggers to launch a scene - audio - now midi and a great host for plug ins, the EZ Drummer looks nice on your pic so i may look at that option.