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  • Sd3 velocity curves ..... Roland trigger parameters

    Ok so its confusing.

    I thought it best to get the triggers in Roland Module good and then set V Curves in SD3 if required. So I did that.

    Sounds decent through headphones.
    Plugged into monitors ( 2 x EV ZLX12BT ) and volume/ triggers are really low.

    If I click the mouse on the Kick drum for example, its like WOW and exactly what I want to hear. However when I use my pedal itself you hardly hear the kick.

    I'm happy to save a preset for monitors and one for headphones in SD3 but the trigger parameters in TD27 module seem to go across ALL kits so if I increase them then my headphone kits will be triggered way too hot.

    I guess I'm asking the best way to mix, balance this.

    Cheers
    Last edited by Wotto; 07-09-20, 08:42 PM.

  • #2
    Ok since I have also own Superior 3.0 and Td 50 (Td 27 seems similar regarding settings)
    please notice,
    Sound, velocity
    1. use trigger sensitivity in module, to get in the appropriate hitting range, where you want to play, where the kit sounds the best, normally mid range, the hardest hits probably not 120-127

    2. only tweak velocity tab inside superior 3.0 to cure things, I.e. roll off steep curve on the top to avoid the loudest velocities, if they are annoying, with digital snare I do this very rarely.....

    My trigger settings inside module mostly for superior
    I would use on Roland Td50 module
    (for example playing Ludwig White classic Kit with Colosseum Snare)
    Roland module:
    Digital snare 8-10 sensitivity, 1.0 Rim
    Gain, linear
    Bass drum 9-10 sensitivity (I own drum tec pro)
    Toms
    Digital ride 15-20 sensitivity, make sure, you use/activate 3 zones in Superior midi menu, you can also even use 7 ride articulations with velocity gate
    Toms: I am waiting for new Roland Vad toms, I use drum tec pro: 4-5 sensitivity in Td 50 and cut often highest velocities inside superior, because of hotspots.

    Volume/balance of kit pieces to each other
    to balance the kit pieces volume wise use the volume tab fader of each kit piece on front page.
    Tip: After choosing an articulation you can even level the volume of only this chosen articulation, for example only raising foot chick volume, if only this articulation is too low. Otherwise, volume of the kit piece is affected globally.

    General volume of superior is adjusted with mixing master fader to the right, you can raise it when you lowered other faders like overhead (it alters sound) the adjustment of other mixing faders to the left is altering the sound, use main master fader to cope with volume loss after lowering faders.
    Last edited by Ribot; 07-10-20, 03:30 PM.
    Desktop PC I5 Asus, Asus P8Z77, RME AIO, RME ADI2pro, RME Digiface USB, Mac Air 2014, Zoom Tac2r, Apollo Twin MKI Solo TD30, Vh13, Drum Tec pro pads, BFD3, Henry Hirsch, Peter Erskine, Evil Drums, Superior 3.0, Decades, Cubase 10, Reaper, Ludwig 67 Kit all sizes from 22, Ludwig Cob, 4*14, Slingerland 50s, Paiste Modern Ess, Zildjian Constantinople

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Wotto View Post
      Ok so it's confusing.

      I thought it's best to get the triggers in Roland Module good and then set V Curves in SD3 if required. So I did that.

      Sounds decent through headphones.
      Plugged into monitors (2 x EV ZLX12BT) and volume/ triggers are really low.

      If I click the mouse on the Kick drum for example, it's like WOW and exactly what I want to hear. However, when I use my pedal itself you hardly hear the kick.

      I'm happy to save a preset for monitors and one for headphones in SD3 but the trigger parameters in TD27 module seem to go across ALL kits so if I increase them then my headphone kits will be triggered way too hot.

      I guess I'm asking the best way to mix, balance this.

      Cheers
      Mouse clicking a kit piece is played with the loudest hits with superior, could be you do not play/trigger in a reasonable (way too low) velocity range....you loudest kick hits with the pedal should be only slightly lower than mouse clicked bass drum. See my first post....
      Last edited by Ribot; 07-10-20, 03:29 PM.
      Desktop PC I5 Asus, Asus P8Z77, RME AIO, RME ADI2pro, RME Digiface USB, Mac Air 2014, Zoom Tac2r, Apollo Twin MKI Solo TD30, Vh13, Drum Tec pro pads, BFD3, Henry Hirsch, Peter Erskine, Evil Drums, Superior 3.0, Decades, Cubase 10, Reaper, Ludwig 67 Kit all sizes from 22, Ludwig Cob, 4*14, Slingerland 50s, Paiste Modern Ess, Zildjian Constantinople

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      • #4
        Thanks heaps Ribot.

        Will take a detailed look at that over the weekend
        Appreciate that reply
        Last edited by Wotto; 07-10-20, 07:18 AM.

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        • #5
          Hey Ribot

          Thankyou so much, great starting points got me well underway. Have a kit sounding great through speakers already after following your steps.

          Obviously there's a bit of personal tweaking required as well.

          Can't get that CY18 positional sensing sorted in SD3 edrum midi settings but. Strange because it looks simple compared to hi hat set up and I have those sorted very well....

          Appreciate your time

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Ribot View Post
            Toms: I am waiting for new Roland Vad toms, I use drum tec pro: 4-5 sensitivity in Td 50 and cut often highest velocities inside superior, because of hotspots.
            I am curious to hear your opinion when you get the VAD toms. I just got the Drum-Tec Pro Custom toms (2 rack and one floor) to replace my Roland PD-125 pads (I got tired waiting for Roland to release individual pads for sale).

            I have not yet fired SD3 with the new Toms, just using Alan’s VEX to get acquainted with the new setup.

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            • #7
              What I find works best in my situation is the following.

              On the module, I use LOG1/LOG2 curves, for toms and snare. Inside SD3 (Midi/Edrum settings), I use the opposite: draw an exponential curve (clipped at ~116). I find that I get a smooth, realistic velocity response that way, with hot spots greatly reduced. Cymbals, hats and kick are fine for me at LINEAR.
              Module: TD-9v2. Kick: KD-8, pedal: Iron Cobra with KAT Silent Strike beater. Hats: VH-10 with Tama Swivel hi-hat stand. Snare: PD-120. Toms: 3 x PD-80R. Crashes: CY-12RC, CY-14. Ride: CY-15R. Aux: BT-1.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by monospace View Post
                What I find works best in my situation is the following.

                On the module, I use LOG1/LOG2 curves, for toms and snare. Inside SD3 (Midi/Edrum settings), I use the opposite: draw an exponential curve (clipped at ~116). I find that I get a smooth, realistic velocity response that way, with hot spots greatly reduced. Cymbals, hats and kick are fine for me at LINEAR.
                I am experimenting with this also, probably even better.....do you have a screenshot for your superior exponential curve? What kit pieces do you like best?
                Desktop PC I5 Asus, Asus P8Z77, RME AIO, RME ADI2pro, RME Digiface USB, Mac Air 2014, Zoom Tac2r, Apollo Twin MKI Solo TD30, Vh13, Drum Tec pro pads, BFD3, Henry Hirsch, Peter Erskine, Evil Drums, Superior 3.0, Decades, Cubase 10, Reaper, Ludwig 67 Kit all sizes from 22, Ludwig Cob, 4*14, Slingerland 50s, Paiste Modern Ess, Zildjian Constantinople

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by tgfoyl1472 View Post

                  I am curious to hear your opinion when you get the VAD toms. I just got the Drum-Tec Pro Custom toms (2 rack and one floor) to replace my Roland PD-125 pads (I got tired waiting for Roland to release individual pads for sale).

                  I have not yet fired SD3 with the new Toms, just using Alan’s VEX to get acquainted with the new setup.
                  As already mentioned in other threads, Roland does improve trigger quality on the module side of each model generation, i.e. even on older toms the difference between edge and center hits becomes less "hot spotty", I am very interested how Roland’s vad tom design has an effect on it, because I find hot less hot spot behavior (beside RTL latency under 10ms, and sample pack playability) the main culprits of e-drumming. Less hot spots offer wider dynamic range....

                  The sample packs differ big way in terms of playability...you have to adjust, sometimes not even usable (especially on some bfd3 offerings)
                  Last edited by Ribot; 07-16-20, 04:44 AM.
                  Desktop PC I5 Asus, Asus P8Z77, RME AIO, RME ADI2pro, RME Digiface USB, Mac Air 2014, Zoom Tac2r, Apollo Twin MKI Solo TD30, Vh13, Drum Tec pro pads, BFD3, Henry Hirsch, Peter Erskine, Evil Drums, Superior 3.0, Decades, Cubase 10, Reaper, Ludwig 67 Kit all sizes from 22, Ludwig Cob, 4*14, Slingerland 50s, Paiste Modern Ess, Zildjian Constantinople

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Ribot View Post

                    I am experimenting with this also, probably even better.....do you have a screenshot for your superior exponential curve? What kit pieces do you like best?
                    See attached screenshot.

                    Screen Shot 2020-07-16 at 11.11.41 PM.png

                    This is for the Snare Center. I use a similar curve for the toms (and rims). You could add more nodes to make it smoother, but this works fine for me. Note that this particular curve makes the lower velocities sound softer, you could move the node more towards the center to make the response more "linear". Also note that I'm limiting the highest velocities, so as to not trigger the rimshot samples that Toontrack puts there.
                    Module: TD-9v2. Kick: KD-8, pedal: Iron Cobra with KAT Silent Strike beater. Hats: VH-10 with Tama Swivel hi-hat stand. Snare: PD-120. Toms: 3 x PD-80R. Crashes: CY-12RC, CY-14. Ride: CY-15R. Aux: BT-1.

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                    • #11
                      Oh yeah, kit pieces? I pretty much exclusively play the Premier kit. It sounds pretty good without any processing. The other default kits have their uses, but not when I'm just jamming on my own.
                      Module: TD-9v2. Kick: KD-8, pedal: Iron Cobra with KAT Silent Strike beater. Hats: VH-10 with Tama Swivel hi-hat stand. Snare: PD-120. Toms: 3 x PD-80R. Crashes: CY-12RC, CY-14. Ride: CY-15R. Aux: BT-1.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by monospace View Post
                        Oh yeah, kit pieces? I pretty much exclusively play the Premier kit. It sounds pretty good without any processing. The other default kits have their uses, but not when I'm just jamming on my own.
                        I 2nd the premier kit. I also find it fits in mixes really well with very little processing. Presently I’m trying to set up a few rooms of hansa kits which sound and play great but I haven’t got them to fit in a mix as well as the premier kit yet.
                        Roland TD30 module on TD20 kit SD3 with various kits. Pearl Masters Kit, Yamaha 9000RC original natural wood finish. Cymbals from Zildgian Pasite and Sabian. Loads of percussion bits. Cubase and Wavelab always current versions.

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