I was thinking of putting together a monster V-Session in purple, with a gibraltar rack, and
Kick (120) (kick input)
3 toms (2-100, 1-120) (tom input 1-3)
snare (120) (snare input)
V cymbal pack (hat, 2 crashes, ride) (hat, crash 1, crash 2, ride, Aux 1 input)
KD-7 for foot cowbell (tom 4)
an extra pad for percussion noises (Aux 2)
OK, but I ALSO want an extra crash, splash, and china, ALL as separate cymbals of some sort (I do NOT like triggering two different sounds with one cymbal, as this is not what I am used to with a-drums). So it sounds like I’m three inputs short. The extra cymbals would by CY-6s or Pintechs.
I then began to study piezo and FSR triggering, dual triggering, etc. I think I understand what I can and can’t do with the TD-10 now, but I am also starting to the think the TD-10 is not very well designed. Why does it have 11 piezo/FSR inputs, and only one dual piezo input?
It’s not like I’m going to be choking my kick drum or my toms. 
Let me provide a brief summary of my understanding of triggering. If any of this is wrong, I will happily be corrected. (This is going to form the basis of my first FAQ question, with better writing of course... this is just a hack job, lifted from various posts of feefer’s and harlock's)
First of all, there are three kinds of pads.
a) single-piezo pads (e.g. PD-5/6/80/100),
b) piezo/FSR pads (e.g. PD-7/9/all V-Cymbals),
c) two-piezo pads (e.g. PD-80R/120).
A FSR trigger is electrically different from a piezo trigger. The main benefit of an FSR trigger is that a “squeeze” can be detected.... in other words, it allows for a “choke”, which is useful for cymbals.
FSR triggers do not work on their own, though, they work in conjunction with a piezo trigger. When you hit the edge of a cymbal, or PD9, you are really triggering both the piezo and the FSR trigger at the same time. So, if a piezo/FSR input detects the piezo signal, it treats it as a head trigger. If it detects the piezo AND FSR signals at the same time, it treats it as a rim trigger. If it detects just the FSR, it doesn’t do anything.
Here is where I think Roland drops the ball with the TD-10. (The following is a direct feefer quote).
So, if I’m reading this right, you can associate TWO sounds with EACH input on the TD-10, BUT you must have the RIGHT PAD for the input type in order to access both sounds. And on the TD-10, the "right pad" is almost always (except for the snare input), a piezo/FSR pad like a V-cymbal or a PD-7/9.
Therefore there is NO WAY (officially) to access the second sound on the Kick input or any of the four Tom inputs, if you actually have kicks/toms plugged in to those inputs. Even if you plug a dual triggered pd-120 into a tom input, you CANNOT use the rim on the 120 to trigger a different sound, because the rim trigger is another piezo trigger, not an FSR trigger.
If I understand all this correctly, I think I now understand the purpose of tricks like "shacking" and "grailing", and why they are hard to implement. HOWEVER, all the good posts on those subjects have been DELETED, so I’m still in the dark as to how those tricks would work anyway.
So here is my question: WHY THE HELL DID ROLAND PUT SO MANY Piezo/FSR INPUTS on the TD-10 in the first place?????? Why didn’t they make the Kick and Tom inputs dual piezo, rather than piezo/FSR? It’s not like I’m going to be CHOKING my toms or my kick drum any time soon. If the kick and toms were dual piezo, that’s FIVE extra single piezo pads, cymbals, or kick triggers you could plug in with a simple effects send/return cable, ALL with uniquely assigned sounds. That would make me happy.
To be honest, I was all fired up to drop a big fat wad of cash on piecing together my dream Purple V-Session, but now I’m not so sure. The TD-10 sounds like a real kludge. Maybe I will wait for the TD-15 to come out.
Darren
Kick (120) (kick input)
3 toms (2-100, 1-120) (tom input 1-3)
snare (120) (snare input)
V cymbal pack (hat, 2 crashes, ride) (hat, crash 1, crash 2, ride, Aux 1 input)
KD-7 for foot cowbell (tom 4)
an extra pad for percussion noises (Aux 2)
OK, but I ALSO want an extra crash, splash, and china, ALL as separate cymbals of some sort (I do NOT like triggering two different sounds with one cymbal, as this is not what I am used to with a-drums). So it sounds like I’m three inputs short. The extra cymbals would by CY-6s or Pintechs.
I then began to study piezo and FSR triggering, dual triggering, etc. I think I understand what I can and can’t do with the TD-10 now, but I am also starting to the think the TD-10 is not very well designed. Why does it have 11 piezo/FSR inputs, and only one dual piezo input?


Let me provide a brief summary of my understanding of triggering. If any of this is wrong, I will happily be corrected. (This is going to form the basis of my first FAQ question, with better writing of course... this is just a hack job, lifted from various posts of feefer’s and harlock's)
First of all, there are three kinds of pads.
a) single-piezo pads (e.g. PD-5/6/80/100),
b) piezo/FSR pads (e.g. PD-7/9/all V-Cymbals),
c) two-piezo pads (e.g. PD-80R/120).
A FSR trigger is electrically different from a piezo trigger. The main benefit of an FSR trigger is that a “squeeze” can be detected.... in other words, it allows for a “choke”, which is useful for cymbals.
FSR triggers do not work on their own, though, they work in conjunction with a piezo trigger. When you hit the edge of a cymbal, or PD9, you are really triggering both the piezo and the FSR trigger at the same time. So, if a piezo/FSR input detects the piezo signal, it treats it as a head trigger. If it detects the piezo AND FSR signals at the same time, it treats it as a rim trigger. If it detects just the FSR, it doesn’t do anything.
Here is where I think Roland drops the ball with the TD-10. (The following is a direct feefer quote).
[B}Both TD-8 and TD-10 have 12 inputs to which you can assign any sound and/or pad you wish...
The TD-8 has 4 mono inputs for PD-6/80/100 or KD-7/80/120
1 double piezo input for PD-80R/120
and 7 FSR inputs for PD-7/9 or CY-6/12H/12R.C/14C/15R
The TD-10 has 11 FSR inputs and 1 double piezo input (which I assume is the snare input)
You can plug any pad into any input, knowing how a certain input type control certain types of pads. Ex.: don't expect to trigger the rim of your PD-120 if it's plugged into a FSR input. Or don't expect to trigger the rim of your PD-7 if it's plugged into one of the TD-8's mono inputs...[/B]
The TD-8 has 4 mono inputs for PD-6/80/100 or KD-7/80/120
1 double piezo input for PD-80R/120
and 7 FSR inputs for PD-7/9 or CY-6/12H/12R.C/14C/15R
The TD-10 has 11 FSR inputs and 1 double piezo input (which I assume is the snare input)
You can plug any pad into any input, knowing how a certain input type control certain types of pads. Ex.: don't expect to trigger the rim of your PD-120 if it's plugged into a FSR input. Or don't expect to trigger the rim of your PD-7 if it's plugged into one of the TD-8's mono inputs...[/B]
Therefore there is NO WAY (officially) to access the second sound on the Kick input or any of the four Tom inputs, if you actually have kicks/toms plugged in to those inputs. Even if you plug a dual triggered pd-120 into a tom input, you CANNOT use the rim on the 120 to trigger a different sound, because the rim trigger is another piezo trigger, not an FSR trigger.
If I understand all this correctly, I think I now understand the purpose of tricks like "shacking" and "grailing", and why they are hard to implement. HOWEVER, all the good posts on those subjects have been DELETED, so I’m still in the dark as to how those tricks would work anyway.
So here is my question: WHY THE HELL DID ROLAND PUT SO MANY Piezo/FSR INPUTS on the TD-10 in the first place?????? Why didn’t they make the Kick and Tom inputs dual piezo, rather than piezo/FSR? It’s not like I’m going to be CHOKING my toms or my kick drum any time soon. If the kick and toms were dual piezo, that’s FIVE extra single piezo pads, cymbals, or kick triggers you could plug in with a simple effects send/return cable, ALL with uniquely assigned sounds. That would make me happy.
To be honest, I was all fired up to drop a big fat wad of cash on piecing together my dream Purple V-Session, but now I’m not so sure. The TD-10 sounds like a real kludge. Maybe I will wait for the TD-15 to come out.
Darren
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