Amp Question

[lethic]

Hey, I was wondering, I dont have a PA system, any self-powered speakers or a roland personal monitoring system, but I want to play without headphones. After I buy my electronic drums, I wont have any cash either. The best I have is a Crate GX-140D Guitar Amp. Its big, its loud, will it work for my electronic drums until I get a better setup? Has anyone tried a guitar amp to power their setup? I believe its 140 watts RMS @ 4 ohms. Or will this just screw up my amp?

Thanks, and by the way, I know it will sound bad but as long as it wont seriously damage my amp, I can hear them with less quality for the time..

-Jarek

[puttenvr]

I don't think a guitar system will work because it has different kind of speakers (shallow ones), which are especially designed for guitar sounds.

You need a keyboard amp, a (set of) selfpowered speaker(s) or a PA system with a suitable amp and more than 1 speaker in it. The number of watts is not that important. The output - that is the number of decibels measured at one meter - is.

I bought a used Peavey Electronic drum amp myself because I did not have enough money to buy a huge sound system as well. It is only 130 watts but makes a lot of noise and loud enough for monitoring. When playing live I plug in my e-drums in the front of house mixer. Perhaps such second hand sound system is suitable for you as well.

[Tom Berry]

Lethic,
Somebody jump on me if I'm wrong, but, can't you run the drums thru your home stereo at low volumes. I think it even shows that in the owners manuel.

[Boingo]

Assuming you are talking live performances, it would be irresponsible for anyone on this site to recommend you do this.

For personal enjoyment, I used a home stereo for a short time until I got an amp (I also ended up with a Peavey). If you want to use the Crate for this, you must dicipline yourself to keep the volume on the low side (and never make the mistake of having the volume cranked unknowingly).

Don't let those watts fool you. For watts to increase the volume, you need to know the increase is logarithmic. I read in an old Stereo Review that, in simple terms, if you want to double 15 watts, plan on adding a zero on the end, i.e., 150 watts. Also, the power consumption and energy levels required for loud bass are way different than what's required for the high end. Since your Crate isn't made for the bass, the risk of toasting it while running less than 140 watts is great. Running a sustained low tone with distortion (where the signal clips) at under the rated watts can easily toast your unit and wipe away the false sense of security those 140 watts gave you.

You have been warned!

[Tom Berry]

Lethic,
I was under the impression you were talking about using your edrums at home for practice at low volume. I can't imagine anyone taking their home stereo out to use on a live gig. I'm sure that you could do damage to the stereo if you played at loud volumes. I was just trying to give you a cheap solution practicing at home.

[lethic]

Thanks you guys, I think after reading this, until I can get some sort of setup that will work good in the long run (most likely a set of powered-speakers) Ill try to bug my dad for his piano amp and test that out.

-Jarek

[rudi-mint]

Originally posted by lethic:
Thanks you guys, I think after reading this, until I can get some sort of setup that will work good in the long run (most likely a set of powered-speakers) Ill try to bug my dad for his piano amp and test that out.

-Jarek

Great idea!! I personally like the idea of the powered speakers. They are easy to carry and set up. You could start with just one. I have a Mackie srm450, and it really puts out. Someday I would like to get another one but one works really well. Maybe you could find something cheap on ebay.

Kurt

[DJourg]

Originally posted by lethic:
...but I want to play without headphones.

I've reviewed the suggestions in previous posts and I wonder if you should just reconsider headphones. Even with inexpensive ones, the V-drums sound pretty good (and they sound excellent with pricey ones). If you want to jam with bandmates or friends -- or even just show them off to visitors -- I certainly understand, but if its just you and the V's why not?

[lethic]

Ooops, I dont think I conveyed my message very well. I am going to be spending a large ammount of time WITH headphones. That is certainly one of the main reasons for getting electronic drums. BUT, I jam with alot of people and like to show people new stuff/sounds/etc and thats where this message came in. To clarify, I do have a good set of headphones, and will use them often!

-Jarek

[Oz DrumR]

Just a little bit off topic here - but I guess I could be speaking to the right guys . . . .

What level of decibels at one meter does an acoustic kit (with NO amplification) generate . . . I know that this will be dependent on many, many factors such as setup, style of playing (Genre), how hard the things are being hit. I'm after a very rough idea for an average setup at volume (not intimate Jazz or Thrash Metal).

The bottom line is what dB level would I require of a PA for my V's to reproduce the level of un-amplified acoustics?

I have a V Custom set and a PM3 - on the face of it, it seems that the PM3 can kick out a similar volume to my unmiked acoustics . . . may this be the case?

I know there are many if's & but's - however if any of you can offer an idea, that would be good.

Cheers (& sorry for straying a little off thread!)

Andy

[Leo]

I once measured my Pearls, and 110db is the most I could get the meter to read, near the snare drum.

I play my Vdrums maximun around 90db, which is quite loud for in the house.

These are average readings... peaks are no doute higher.

I might add I use a Technics reciever, 500 watts, and my own custom built speakers. I wouldn't recommend this to people unless they are carefull, and know what they are doing! The kik causes the amp to clip at surprisingly low levels for this much power. I never play over 90db., and at this level, the fan in the amp comes on. I know the speakers can take the power since I designed them, but my 'standard' stereo speakers would not survive. I mainly use the set for fun and for recording, so the level is usually closer to 70db.

[This message has been edited by Leo (edited January 14, 2001).]

[puttenvr]

Originally posted by Boingo:
Don't let those watts fool you. For watts to increase the volume, you need to know the increase is logarithmic. I read in an old Stereo Review that, in simple terms, if you want to double 15 watts, plan on adding a zero on the end, i.e., 150 watts.

What I learned (from this site and some books) is a bit different. When a sound system produces 100 decibels (db) at one meter with 200 watts you will only have 103 db with 400 watts and 106 db with 800 watts. What Boingo says about the speakers is true as well.