Announcement

Collapse

Technical Posting Guidelines

TECHNICAL DISCUSSION ONLY! DO NOT POST LOUNGE OR PRODUCT DISCUSSION!

Having issues? Please visit our Forum Talk section for answers to frequently asked questions.

See more
See less

ddrum4 brain with roland triggers?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • ddrum4 brain with roland triggers?

    Can this be done? What are the advantages and disadvantages?

    Thanks...


  • #2
    Originally posted by DRulz:
    Can this be done? What are the advantages and disadvantages?

    Thanks...
    Lots of data on this. Use the search engine and use keyword "puttenvr".

    -

    Comment


    • #3
      LOL Hmm.. ok..

      See, I am a drummer in a metal band, and just recently I found out that ddrums seem to have better acoustic sounds. This is a concern of mine because I would like the drums on our demo to sound as close to being realistic as possible - acoustic. I wonder how a ddrum brain and a vdrum brain can work together with vdrum pads.

      ::sigh::

      Mayde I don't really need the ddrum brain. Perhaps I can just assign a layer of ddrum sounds from a sampler on top of the vdrum sounds?

      Thanks Marc

      [This message has been edited by DRulz (edited December 19, 2000).]

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by DRulz:
        This is a concern of mine because I would like the drums on our demo to sound as close to being realistic as possible - acoustic. sounds?
        Jason, I couldn't pass that one up. If you want realistic drum sounds, you will need real drums. Remember kids ...

        ... Real Drummers Use Real Drums!

        -

        Comment


        • #5
          LOL... I know... I play real drums... but had to pack them up because neighbors were complaining... hence my vdrum purchase (play thru headphones)...

          so, since I have the recording equipmment set up for our demo, I would like to make the vdrums sound as close to acoustic drums as possible.

          :/

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Marc.:
            If you want realistic drum sounds, you will need real drums.
            This is strange. I read a few times on this site that e-drums are a new instrument and from this are allowed to sound different. But the more I think about this the more I dislike this. It is separating the sound from the instrument, isn't it? We talk about a drum kit and not about a zummmxxx-kit.

            Let's go to the hi-hat. This machine already was invented in 1928 and since then has never changed in concept really. This is because we drummers - real drummers Marc. - want hi-hat sounds. Untill the first person stands up and says " I will use slamming car doors for my hi-hat " untill that moment we're all just searching for drum sounds. And untill that moment companies like Roland, Yamaha and Clavia put hi-hat sounds and other drum sounds into their brains from which they claim that these sounds sound quite natural and sound like a real drum. And until that moment the companies manufact hi-hat machines or controllers for e-drums. As well as a snare with a rim shot and rim click. And cymbal pads. All just normal parts from a drum kit. Hence we spend thousands of dollars and are more or less happy with our e-drums.

            So I will not accept that the e-drum is separated from the sound-needs we have. It is not a new instrument. It's only an instrument which makes its sounds electronically instead of acoustically. And I will always stay looking for the most realistic sounding drum brain. At this moment it is <font color=ff0000> ddrum </font>
            Robert

            Comment


            • #7
              DRulz, in answer to your questions:

              Yes, it can be done since you will have a proper trigger signal. But the signal will not be proper anough to cover all functions from the electronic brain. I learned that the software in the drum brains is fine tuned to the drum pads, piezo trigger (signal kind), thickness of the foam and metal plate to which the trigger is glued. Hence why Roland pads work 100 percent with Roland modules and ddrum with ddrum. I have some problems with my SIB drumpads (beautiful pads) so I know where I am talking about.
              Robert

              Comment


              • #8
                Thanks for the info. I guess it would be more cost-effective if I just d/l the ddrum samples from somewhere and use a software sampler to trigger them when I playback the midi data from my sequencer (Logic).

                Just out of curiousity though, what's the difference between vdrums and ddrums? Do the ddrums have positional sensing? Or basically it's just a single sound file that cannot be edited in anyway? Vdrums allow for a lot of editing (V-edit), so that's a cool feature.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by DRulz:
                  Just out of curiousity though, what's the difference between vdrums and ddrums?
                  Lots of data on this Jason. Use the wonderful search engine and type in keyword "puttenvr".

                  -

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Yeah, I know


                    Puttenvr is the man!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      DRulz (and all else interested),

                      In much the same way as the vdrums sound different in headphones than they do live, they sound different when recorded with a bunch of other instruments in the mix than they do in headphones by themselves.

                      I have recorded with both acoustic and the v-drums, and although the process of playing the drums is "more pleasurable" on the real drums, the sound is quite similar, once mixed...In fact, I prefer the sound we got at home because we had the time to really make it right rather than letting an engineer make them sound the way he wanted them to. This assumes that you are going for a pretty "produced" sound. Example, Led Zepplin - don't try this at home. I've not heard an electronic kit that sounds LIKE the Bonham stuff. I've heard stuff as big, as loud, as blah blah blah, but never anything JUST LIKE it.

                      If, however, you want a produced sound (i.e. not sounding like a recording made in a garage or concrete hall with a few ambiant mikes and an overall "dirty" sound), the v-drums will perform quite admirably. The cymbals seem to be a BIG problem when you try to swell a crash or something by itself, but when put in a mix and properly EQed (take some lows out), I was amazed at how real the cymbals actually sound.

                      Personal preference, I like the way my v-drums sound recorded better than I like the demos that I've heard of the ddrums. Can anyone (puttenvr?) provide a demo that will convince me the ddrums sounds any more "real"? Except the congas and such...they just don't work well...they are missing that hand-slapping expression that makes them so cool.

                      That said, I like a produced sound better than a raw one. If I wanted a raw sound, I'd just load my real drums back into the basement, set up a few shure sm58s and bang away. One of the main reasons I got the Vs was to avoid my drums always sounding like I recorded them at home. Now they don't.

                      I will provide an mp3 as we finish the mixes that we are working on now. I have pointed to a link before, but I don't think its a good example, as it was quantized, and mp3ed (badly) and it was a VERY ROUGH MIX. The real mixes sound amazing, though, off of a VS-1680.

                      They are not METAL or even hard rock, but they sound like a VERY WELL MIKED PRO LEVEL KIT.
                      My Updated Website: https://blades.technology

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by redbrick:
                        Can anyone (puttenvr?) provide a demo that will convince me the ddrums sounds any more "real"? Except the congas and such...they just don't work well...they are missing that hand-slapping expression that makes them so cool.
                        First: sorry: I can't. There are some mp3 files on Clavia's site as well as all the ddrum4 sounds and a PC Tool. Download them and listen to the sounds. I have no possibility to record the sounds from my ddrum4 into a demo or so.

                        Second: I don't think there are much differences between the ddrums and Vdrums when they are recorded. When I was talking about the differences between the two instruments I always talked about playing live. And on this I made my decissions to change. But last sunday I heard some recorded Vdrums and - yes - they sounded great too.
                        Robert

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Puttenvr,

                          thanks for responding. Glad I'm not going crazy.

                          One thing that I think a lot of people miss out on is what drums go through in the studio from the raw recording to the final mix. Like should be done, most (if not all) of the big acts record their drums DRY and then EQ, effect, compress, etc the signal to come up with something like Metallica's or Phil Collins' sound. I'd be real interested in hearing the dry recorded, unmixed drum tracks.

                          Also, what the drums sound like in headphones compared to how they sound in a mix is quite different. When played by themselves, all the frequencies are heard, when in a MIX, some of the frequencies are masked by other instruments, which makes the drums sound different. Just like hitting a crash with or without the kick drum. To me, real cymbals sound terrible when struck by themselves, rather than with a kick or snare, but when in a mix, they sound fantastic.

                          Just some opinions.
                          redbrick
                          My Updated Website: https://blades.technology

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            One other thing...to bring this back ON TOPIC (sorry):

                            In the long run, getting a ddrums brain to use in addition or in place of (as in, trade them in and out for different tunes/styles) the td-10, I'd probably like to get a ddrum4 brain IF it would work VERY WELL with the Roland Pads. Best of both worlds...but I still need to see/hear the new DTX brain and see how it would fare on Roland pads.

                            redbrick
                            My Updated Website: https://blades.technology

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              The ddrum4 brain perhaps (I am not sure) will work with the Vdrum pads because it has special software for mesh head triggering from version 1.04. But try before you buy. Perhaps the software is fine-tuned for the ddrum triggers on mesh heads and not for other triggers beneath a meshead.
                              Robert

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X