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  • #16
    Originally posted by jay888bee View Post
    Many thanks jpsquared482. I think I may have gone wrong in hitting as hard as I can to reach the top velocity. My lightest ghost notes donít seem to be triggering. Iíll do as you say and try hitting the pads at my normal level hits. When you play the rim are we talking the rim on the head towards the edge of the drum or the actual black rim of the pd128? Sorry if Iím being dense.
    Rim means the hoop of the drum (the black rubber trim), not the perimeter of the mesh head.
    ATV aDrums & aD5, Pearl Mimic Pro, Roland Handsonic HPD-20.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by jpsquared482 View Post

      If you are having trouble with ghost notes, please be aware that the Mimic has a limit on how soft your ghost notes will be produced in terms of actual dB. That limit is probably a lot higher than your softest hits. In other words, ghost notes require more strike velocity than you might want them to require. Or, put another way, the Mimic doesn't produce infinitesimally low volume ghost notes.

      What you' re looking for when setting input gain is for soft (not your softest) notes to register consistently - meaning, all soft hits at the same level of softness will register as a soft hit. To find that level, simply hit soft hits consistently and keep raising the input gain value until they trigger consistently. Then, make your adjustment to top velocity..

      Things can help the volume, there is the dynamic fader curve control the volume of the ghost notes, move it at 100, it will reduce the volume of the ghost notes, as well the default trigger curve at bottom left, default is not strait curve linear, if set at bottom complete linear curve (strait bottom), the volume will decrease even a bit more. But too much low ghosts notes will not audible when music as well. Depend on the snare, fx on mic\ layers, each ghost notes softness will be different.

      As for trigger signal, if set properly, its should triggers with a single soft finger touch. All Module have minimal threshold will never trigs below slights signal level


      Originally posted by jpsquared482 View Post
      d. Then, select "capture top velocity. Strike the head 5 times, fairly consistently at your hardest normal striking force. You're not trying to bash as hard as you can. Just hit at your at a strike force that is equal to your typical hardest hit. Don't overdo it. There will still be some headroom above that. Look at the meter on the left. The red line is the level that you're setting for "top velocity". As you hit even harder (above "top velocity"), you see that it's possible to go above the red line.
      But by doing this you create shorter dynamic range\volume for PPP\ FFF range physical strike, the top velocity determine the gap from lowest to highest sample, doing normal playing will affect the gap from lower\higher sample volume\dynamic with the force of the strike.

      When the fade level goes above the top velocity line, it means you reached FFF earlier then it should, (highest sample strikes easily) the dynamic range and sample layers are affected. Try hardest bash 5 time, and see how much the lowest ghost note will sound lower on volume and the gap range have changed from PPP to FFF, especially on the ride and hihats, there is noticeable difference.
      Last edited by Chris K; 04-16-18, 02:54 AM.

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      • #18
        Gentlemen you are the best. Thank you for all your help. I will let you know how I get on!!

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Chris K View Post
          But by doing this you create shorter dynamic range\volume for PPP\ FFF range physical strike, the top velocity determine the gap from lowest to highest sample, doing normal playing will affect the gap from lower\higher sample volume\dynamic with the force of the strike.

          When the fade level goes above the top velocity line, it means you reached FFF earlier then it should, (highest sample strikes easily) the dynamic range and sample layers are affected. Try hardest bash 5 time, and see how much the lowest ghost note will sound lower on volume and the gap range have changed from PPP to FFF, especially on the ride and hihats, there is noticeable difference.
          I agree with Chris that you don't want to see the fader level going above the top velocity line during normal playing. The point I wanted to make is that you also don't want to create a dynamic range that is "too wide" wherein you never see the fader level reach top velocity during normal playing. In other words, you want your hardest hits that YOU normally play to be right at the top, not higher, and not having to use a bashing blow that you would never use in normal playing. Getting that balance right is important.

          While setting up top velocity, if you input a hit that is much harder than the hardest hits you would use in normal playing, then you will not utilize the top velocity layers as you may like. You want to match your normal playing (including your hardest hits during your normal playing) to the dynamic range of the module. As Chris points out, if you can push the level above the top velocity line (red line), that means you have exceeded the optimal top velocity, and that affects how velocity layers are optimized. However, I would point out that there's a balance to getting the top velocity "right" for YOU. You want the hardest hit that YOU would strike while performing to be right at the top velocity. It's OK to be able to see a strike that exceeds the red line if that strike force is by hitting at a level that you would never use in actual playing.

          I advise using "capture top velocity" to get it in the right range. Then experiment by adjusting top velocity manually, in small amounts, to your liking. Listen to how the dynamic range responds in terms of tone relative to dynamics. Top velocity layers should be reserved for your hardest hits so it sounds like an actual drum would respond to your liking. If you hear those too soon
          ATV aDrums & aD5, Pearl Mimic Pro, Roland Handsonic HPD-20.

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          • #20
            Right Iíve got you. I think that is why my HH is not responding too well. On another note, I have a Peavey PV8 mixer from my gigging days. Is it worth using it with the Mimic for when Iím jamming to songs or is it a bit overkill and not really worth it? Really appreciate your time guys.

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            • #21
              i would recommend loading songs in the song player or plugging an external player to aux inputs directly to the mimic.. i have a mackie cr1604vlz, and was overkill, besides, it sounds better with headphone plugged directly to the MP.
              Pearl Mimic pro, A to E 7 piece Pearl Decade maple, ddrum Deccabons, Ddrum DDTi, UFO X-bar triggers, Real feel heads, Gibraltar rack, VH13, PD105 side snare, Roc-N-Soc,Tama Iron Cobra, Iron cobra high hat stand, Cobra clutch, Pearl throne thumper, Roland and Kit Toys cymbals, Roland KC 500, Promark

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              • #22
                Originally posted by jay888bee View Post
                Right Iíve got you. I think that is why my HH is not responding too well. On another note, I have a Peavey PV8 mixer from my gigging days. Is it worth using it with the Mimic for when Iím jamming to songs or is it a bit overkill and not really worth it? Really appreciate your time guys.

                Back to ghost notes on snare, you should have at least this level as default setting https://youtu.be/TQ5lXIEsEIY?t=153

                lower then that, will start to be not audible, and with music, forget it, hence they added dynamic fader slider to control ghost-notes volume for any single instruments.
                Last edited by Chris K; 04-17-18, 05:35 PM.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by Chris K View Post
                  Back to ghost notes on snare, you should have at least this level as default setting https://youtu.be/TQ5lXIEsEIY?t=153
                  lower then that, will start to be not audible, and with music, forget it, hence they added dynamic fader slider to control ghost-notes volume for any single instruments.
                  I agree that we don't *need* ultra soft ghost notes, and they are often lost in the music, but it is satisfying as a player to hear a note, no matter how soft it is played.

                  By "dynamic fader slider" we're referring to the fader located on p.27 of the current manual (v 1.07), correct? Dialing a value of 100 gives you the softest possible ghost notes. As you said above, also lowering the first blue point on the velocity curve can lower it a bit more.

                  Is there a reason we wouldn't always want the dynamics set to 100 and the curve to start at "0"? If this gives the most sensitive, softest possible ghost notes, why not use those values?
                  ATV aDrums & aD5, Pearl Mimic Pro, Roland Handsonic HPD-20.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by jpsquared482 View Post
                    Is there a reason we wouldn't always want the dynamics set to 100 and the curve to start at "0"? If this gives the most sensitive, softest possible ghost notes, why not use those values?
                    we had a lot of requests to "make the ghost notes louder"
                    It's truly a matter of personal taste

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Mr.Boo View Post

                      we had a lot of requests to "make the ghost notes louder"
                      It's truly a matter of personal taste
                      That's very strange to me. If a player wants louder ghost notes, just play them a littler harder, right? The same principle applies to acoustic drums, or any other instrument for that matter. When I play soft dynamics I want soft sound output, plain and simple. Who are these people? I want names!
                      Last edited by jpsquared482; 04-17-18, 06:53 PM.
                      ATV aDrums & aD5, Pearl Mimic Pro, Roland Handsonic HPD-20.

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by jpsquared482 View Post

                        That's very strange to me. If a player wants louder ghost notes, just play them a littler harder, right? The same principle applies to acoustic drums, or any other instrument for that matter. When I play soft dynamics I want soft sound output, plain and simple. Who are these people? I want names!
                        I have saw this many time on video people complaining, also even peter warren told it could be louder at winter namm before it was released etc.., but they explained later there was control for this. but I guess everyone interpret ghost notes and how much it should be audible. The reality is, with dense music rock, heavy metal and loud mix music, ghost will never be audible in any way with acoustic drum, you can see Neil Peart using ghost notes all the time, with his famous ride pattern, but on album there is no sound at all.

                        Yes , page 27 on the manual, these are default value, I use 100 dynamic, and linear curve at bottom left, the curve cancel sample layers, so the bottom it cancel early sample layer library sound at default.
                        dynamic.jpg
                        Last edited by Chris K; 04-17-18, 11:34 PM.

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Mr.Boo View Post

                          we had a lot of requests to "make the ghost notes louder"
                          It's truly a matter of personal taste
                          And itís a matter of proper mixing and compression. Iím focusing on ghost notes more (due to some requests) in the next release.
                          Alan
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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by jpsquared482 View Post

                            That's very strange to me. If a player wants louder ghost notes, just play them a littler harder, right? The same principle applies to acoustic drums, or any other instrument for that matter. When I play soft dynamics I want soft sound output, plain and simple. Who are these people? I want names!
                            I have seen many E drum videos where the ghost notes are too quiet. A real drum in a smaller performance room is still fairly loud with ghost notes. I have experienced quiet notes disappearing in the mix with Edrums.

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Peter Warren View Post

                              I have seen many E drum videos where the ghost notes are too quiet. A real drum in a smaller performance room is still fairly loud with ghost notes. I have experienced quiet notes disappearing in the mix with Edrums.
                              I think we're getting carried away by trying to make ghost notes louder by tricking the trigger settings. Just play them a tad louder, right?
                              ATV aDrums & aD5, Pearl Mimic Pro, Roland Handsonic HPD-20.

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                              • #30
                                It comes down to proper mixing and compression. A drummer's pad calibration should be dialed in properly to begin with. Those dialed-in settings should be based on default samples, with next to zero mixing/adjustment. The only time curves should start getting messed with is in the case of weak triggering itself - not your playing. I only push the low end curve on rubber CYs, because the rubber gives a little before the trigger kicks in. Mesh should not have this issue as much. (except maybe in the case of worn cones)

                                Peter is also right, in a sense. A lot of it comes down to the song you are playing with... and the above I just mentioned. Those ghost notes you here in any modern music are due to mixing and compression.

                                I'll add this to my video "to-do" topics. I didn't concentrate too much in Origins expansion on these types of kits/mixes. (although, there are a few that do have prominent compression in this area) However, as I've seen a need and commenting over the past month for more detail in this area, I am specifically doing a batch of kits in the next pack to address these desires.
                                Alan
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