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Low volume for master out to PA speaker for td-50-kv

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  • Low volume for master out to PA speaker for td-50-kv

    The volume is low when I connect my td-50-kv to an active PA speaker through the unbalanced master out port. It is barely audible when the master volume on the module and PA speaker are at maximum levels. However, the volume is within an acceptable range when I connect to the PA speaker through the headphone output. This rules out a problem with the speaker and/or the cable. I tried restoring the factor setting, but to no avail. Is a setting configured incorrectly or is there a problem with my module? Any advice or recommendations would be greatly appreciated.

  • #2
    R or L/MONO?

    MASTER OUT (BALANCED) jacks
    Connect these to your mixer, amplified speakers, or recording device. If you want to output in mono, connect only the L/MONO jack of the MASTER OUT (UNBALANCED) jacks
    .
    (TD-50 manual, Page 9.)

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    • #3
      Thanks for your reply. I tried both R and L/Mono and got the same result.

      I don't have a cable for the balanced ports, but I'm not sure that would make a difference, right?

      Comment


      • #4
        Are you using TS or TRS cables? You'll be getting low output if your PA is expecting +4dBu levels instead of -10dBV.

        Use TS cables if unbalanced, TRS if balanced.

        If I were you though, I would be using those XLR jacks - it's one of the few advantages the TD-50 has.
        ♦ Diamond Drums 4pc in Di-Noc carbon ♦ MegaDRUM + Roland UA-1010 / cymbals / KT-10 (x2) ♦ Tama / Gibraltar hardware ♦ JBL LSR3 Series 2.1 Monitoring
        Community Drum Module Document
        PA Comparison sheet (wip)

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        • #5
          Thanks Kabonfabia. You will have to forgive me as this is my first foray into speakers. I like your idea about using the XLR jacks but it seems that they cannot be used with one speaker. Is that true?



          I'm not positive, but I suspect the cable I am using is mono TS. I could not find info regarding the dBu Here is a link to the cable I am using. Its for a

          guitar. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1


          Here is what I found regarding the speaker: Sensitivity (SPL): 96dB 1W/1M. But I'm not positive that is relevant. Here is the link to the speaker I have.


          http://www.musiciansfriend.com/pro-a...#productDetail

          Comment


          • #6
            Thanks for the info.

            Since the Kustom KPX112P only has balanced inputs I would use a TRS cable, not TS (otherwise known as guitar cable) to respect the circuitry of the amp (the device at the end of the chain) which would be 3 pin TRS (The 3 pins on TRS being: Tip, Ring, Sleeve)

            It's not necessary to learn much beyond that, as it's troublesome to have to find out exact schematics from manufacterers from both devices and find out whats really going on. Better idea is just to have all types of cable in your toolbox so you can experiment.

            Using 1 XLR jack to speaker is absolutely possible! Depending on whether the TD50 circuitry actually recognises the use of 1 XLR jack in the L/Mono side and adjusts the mixing accordingly is another matter, but I expect it does.

            96dB SPL is the maximum average loudness (or volume) that your speaker can output, measured from 1 metre away. 96dB isn't that loud for a 12 inch PA but that's reflected in it's price tbh so can't complain other than to say it's underwhelming power for vdrums.
            Last edited by Kabonfaiba; 01-08-17, 08:13 AM.
            ♦ Diamond Drums 4pc in Di-Noc carbon ♦ MegaDRUM + Roland UA-1010 / cymbals / KT-10 (x2) ♦ Tama / Gibraltar hardware ♦ JBL LSR3 Series 2.1 Monitoring
            Community Drum Module Document
            PA Comparison sheet (wip)

            Comment


            • #7
              I always say use TRS for 1/4" and DMX for XLR inputs / outputs. Cost is small and very few instruments, amps etc (if any) will have a problem with their use.
              100 watts for a PA is not going to put out much volume as far as vdrums go.
              You can maximize the volume available by using a mixer +4 or -10 dbv can make a big difference to the speaker and can be controlled by most mixers.
              I have heard of some 1000 watt speakers not getting great volume til a mixer was used with vdrums.
              To be totally honest, If you are going to spend $6000 - $8000 on vdrums you probably should spend $1000 - $2000 on a PA to hear it.
              The sound of any electric instrument is only going to be as good as the speaker you use for listening.
              The same can be true for IEM's or headphones also.
              It is hard to get around the fact that edrums is / can be expensive and you pretty much get what you pay for these days.
              Best of luck to you.
              "It makes sense if you dont think about it"

              ????????, TD9 side module, 2-QSC K-10s, K-sub, and a bunch of other expensive cool things!

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              • #8
                The Roland manual states "If you want to output in mono, connect only the L/MONO jack of the MASTER OUT (UNBALANCED) jacks. on page 9. It seems to suggest that using XLR with one speaker is not possible, but maybe I do not understand how it works. I guess trying the XLR cable is worth a shot.

                One thing that still perplexes me is that the volume can achieve loud levels when I connect via the headphones jack. So while the PA speakers are cheap, the volume is acceptable for casual playing. If you have any ideas why it works via the headphone jack but not the master out TS, I would be interested in knowing. Thanks again for the suggestions.

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                • #9
                  Thanks Intruder. I do plan on getting better speakers eventually and I did invest in better headphones because that is what I use primarily (and it was worth the investment).

                  But if you have any idea why I get acceptable volume via the headphone jack and not the master output, I would like to know. It almost seems like the master output is defective... or maybe it works differently for some reason.

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                  • #10
                    The headphone jack is a stereo out that if you are using a TS cable on only gives you the right side it is also more like +10 Dbv out depending on how you have the volume for the phones set. This would be more like using a mixer out to the speaker.
                    Just my best guesses of course based on experience not electronic knowledge.
                    "It makes sense if you dont think about it"

                    ????????, TD9 side module, 2-QSC K-10s, K-sub, and a bunch of other expensive cool things!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Hey Fisherc2,

                      I have been playing a Roland TD-15 for stage performances through a PA for many years now. (I also have a TD-50 module on pre-order, supposed to arrive next month). I have found that the TD-15's 1/4" outputs are VERY low signals compared to a lot of other "line level" signals you might expect. This causes them not to work very well with many mixer/PAs with 1/4" inputs that expect higher line level inputs.

                      My band runs a mono PA mix, so I also have been using the Left/Mono output. What I have had to do for many years is run the 1/4" output of the module to a Direct Box (something like this: https://www.amazon.com/Behringer-DI4...rds=direct+box). The direct box does impedance matching and converts the 1/4" unbalance output signal to a balanced XLR output. You can then use an XLR cable to connect the direct box to your mixer or PA. In my experience most mixers or PA 1/4" line input jacks expect a much hotter signal than the Roland modules put out. But the XLR inputs ot a mixer or PA (often used for microphones) expect a much lower signal level that is more compatible with the Roland module's output level.

                      I was hoping that, once I receive my new TD-50, I could stop having use the direct box for connecting to the mixer since the new module already has XLR output jacks. I suspect (although I can't confirm with my own experience for you yet) that the levels that you get using the XLR outputs will be much better for your mixer/PA input. But the only question that I still have is one that you have already asked: will the module support mono output when using just the left XLR output? I have read the manual, like you, and it is definitely a bit vague there. This is definitely an important question to me. If the module does not support mono outputs from the left XLR jack I will have to either: 1.) Have to continue using the direct box connected to the left 1/4" output. OR 2.) Reprogram all of my kits to have all instruments panned hard left for mono operation (but that would mess up how they sound in the headphones).

                      I would very much love to find some reliable confirmation on the answer to that question. If anyone who has TD-50 can absolutely confirm for us whether the XLR outputs support mono operation I would really appreciate it! Otherwise I'll have to wait until February and confirm it for myself.

                      Thanks!

                      Troy

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                      • #12
                        The XLR outputs on the TD50 are a lot louder. Just run a cable from left Mono out to the speaker.

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                        • #13
                          Hi Peter,

                          I appreciate the input from someone who currently has experience with the TD-50. Are you SURE that by using the left XLR output alone it will correctly process the signal as mono and not just outputting the left channel info? The TD-50 manual is confoundingly unclear on that point. I'm just asking for clarification because the XLR output on the back panel is not labeled "L/Mono" like the unbalanced 1/4" jack is.

                          Thanks very much for your help! This is one of my last unanswered questions about the TD-50 before I actually get mine.

                          Troy

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