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2box MIDI hi-hat

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  • 2box MIDI hi-hat

    Has anyone used a MIDI device to control a 2box, especially the hi-hat?

    Basically want to upgrade my mini-kit's TD-9 module to a 2box module and am trying to identify workable
    scenarios before I sink time and money into it, and the hats are the main issue with the 2box.

    The scenarios I am thinking of include:
    - an external MIDI controller like an Octopad, one pad devoted to the hat, and an HH (DIY) pedal connected directly to the 2box.
    - alternatively I could connect a Roland FD-8 pedal to the octopad if the 2box can interpret Roland MIDI HH events,
    this is the more "pure MIDI" solution, but I don't know if Roland MIDI can drive a 2box.

    JMan's converter box might allow the creation of a DIY pedal for the first scenario, using an FD-8 or maybe a kick pedal to mount the magnet.

    I also don't know about MIDI compatibility for Roland vs 2box Hat Pedal events, was hoping somebody here would know.

    And I am assuming that MIDI for the rest of the drums (cymbals, toms, snare) would be fine.
    Mini-kit: TD-9 + Alesis Control Pad + Alesis Sample Pad + PDX-6 snare
    Micro-kit: Handsonic HPD-20 + an old pair of hands.
    Speakers: QSC-K10 "thumper", DBR-10 "little thumper"

  • #2
    Kurth,.

    can't really help regarding MIDI-events...

    But I would bypass the HH via midi usage (for possible latency reasons), and run a 'Converter-Box'-modded FD-7 or FD-8 straight into the 'HIHAT'-input on the back of the 2box-module itself!


    HTH


    "My best friends' name is J-SON. They used to call him 'Mr. Parse.' He has an 'Error'..!"

    http://www.vdrums.com/forum/core/cus...ar33631_4.jpeg

    Comment


    • #3
      Yeah that's my preferred solution. I understand I can buy the extender, SD card, and converter from jman.

      Just wondering if anyone has used a pedal for hi-hat control, and MIDI events for the hat hits.
      Mini-kit: TD-9 + Alesis Control Pad + Alesis Sample Pad + PDX-6 snare
      Micro-kit: Handsonic HPD-20 + an old pair of hands.
      Speakers: QSC-K10 "thumper", DBR-10 "little thumper"

      Comment


      • #4
        Gutting an FD6/7/8 pedal and replacing it with the "box mod" to use by itself would work just fine if having a moving hat is not a priority. However you could still use this particular stand mod application like a lot of folks did with the FD-7s when for Roland modules that wanted moving hats. Frankly though...mounting the box mod directly to your favorite HH stand/remote will save you from having to gut/cut up the pedal and stand.

        The hats are really a non issue once you get a good stand and them set up correctly...especially when using the box mod and your favorite type of cymbal pad that you are used to. They function every bit as well as the VH12/13 (and DIY versions of the these) did with their respective Roland modules...including the TD30....but the tones are much nicer.
        8 piece DIY Acrylic, 2x2Box DrumIt5, Gen16 4xDCP, DIY Acrylic&Gen16 Conversions, Sleishman Twin-QuadSteele hybrid, Gibraltar&DrumFrame rack, DW9502LB, Midi Knights Pro Lighting
        http://www.airbrushartists.org/DreamscapeAirbrushRealm

        Comment


        • jpsquared482
          jpsquared482 commented
          Editing a comment
          Hey Daniel, I'd like to know what "good stand" you're using and what type of "box mod" as well, so we followers don't have to reinvent the wheel?
          Thanks!

        • jpsquared482
          jpsquared482 commented
          Editing a comment
          Hey Daniel, I'd like to know what "good stand" you're using and what type of "box mod" as well, so we followers don't have to reinvent the wheel?
          Thanks!

        • fulrmr(Daniel)
          fulrmr(Daniel) commented
          Editing a comment
          There have been many "good stand" suggestions for these but I use a DW9502LB remote. Basically what you will need is a stand with a strong adjustable spring. As far as "box mods" go...I built my own from the 2Box hat pad. http://www.vdrums.com/forum/forum/ad...-hh-conversion

          Jerry sells one that eliminates all the deconstruction and adds a nice feature for dialing in pads that could be "hotter" than the standard 2Box pads was.

      • #5
        I doubt that he will want to use a hihat-stand... (okay, to be fair, he could mount his Samplepad from there)

        His setup is a Mini-Kit, that's all about being compact! Hence the frequent mentioning of the Alesis CP/Octapad.

        http://www.vdrums.com/forum/forum/pe...-at-a-mini-kit



        HTH


        "My best friends' name is J-SON. They used to call him 'Mr. Parse.' He has an 'Error'..!"

        http://www.vdrums.com/forum/core/cus...ar33631_4.jpeg

        Comment


        • fulrmr(Daniel)
          fulrmr(Daniel) commented
          Editing a comment
          He'd have to use a static pad/cymbal at the very least for use with the modded FD pedal with the 2Box. The Sample pads won't do it which is why I'm sure he asked about the midi...and as you said...I too believe this would yield less than desirable results.

        • hairmetal-81
          hairmetal-81 commented
          Editing a comment
          I was not precise enough, and my reply made everything just a little more confusing! Allow to rephrase:


          - i think, he'll likely go the route of static pad/modded pedal. N-O hihat-stand!

          - The Alesis Samplepad I did *not* bring into play for triggering the hihat-sound - just because he has one in his setup.

          - I meant he could just (physically) mount the Samplepad off of a hihiat-stand
          That's IF he would go with a stand (instead of just the controller-pedal). This might be a benefit of using a dedicated stand!

          ...although a slight one, and nowhere near as compact as the modded pedal/static pad solution.


          Can you follow me, after I rephrased?
          :wave:

      • #6
        I just want a plain HH pedal like an FD-8, more than happy to cut one up to get there.
        My HH is on the Control Pad like hairmetal said.

        I don't need to buy the 2box HH stand right? Just buy Jman's converter box?
        Last edited by kurth83; 12-11-13, 10:17 PM.
        Mini-kit: TD-9 + Alesis Control Pad + Alesis Sample Pad + PDX-6 snare
        Micro-kit: Handsonic HPD-20 + an old pair of hands.
        Speakers: QSC-K10 "thumper", DBR-10 "little thumper"

        Comment


        • #7

          Originally posted by kurth83 View Post
          I just want a plain HH pedal like an FD-8, more than happy to cut one up to get there.
          My HH is on the Control Pad like hairmetal said.

          I don't need to buy the 2box HH stand right? Just buy Jman's converter box?
          I read this thread and I don't think it would be possible to do what you are suggesting. The 2Box Hi Hat input is very different than Roland's or other brands (somewhat similar to DDrum because that is the original roots of 2Box really). The 2Box uses a single TRS HH input that has Bow and Edge zone for the HH cymbal plus the HH control function (and it even provides a few volts of power to the HH control board to power the hall sensor on the ring of the jack). With my 2Box HH conversion box/kit it basically splits it off so you can use a different e-Cymbal along with the controller on that TRS input. So you just need almost any type of e-Cymbal .... but your control pad does not have pads with individual outputs, so I don't see that working. You would still need a separate E-cymbal or pad IMO.
          I could tell you where to stick that piezo! ;)
          Stealthdrums.com Mega Kit: Pearl Mimic Pro ,2Box modules,drums and cymbals too many to count. VST quality sounds directly from the Mimic and custom sounds loaded into and played directly from the 2Box modules. Visit me anytime at: http://stealthdrums.com/

          Comment


          • fulrmr(Daniel)
            fulrmr(Daniel) commented
            Editing a comment
            Yep....agreed. Although.....the box would be cool in a pedal like that too...but as you said...he'd still need a pad or cymbal of some sort. Even something small like a PD8 or CY-5 would work fine and still keep the kit compact.

        • #8
          Jerry, couldn't one just modify the control-box some more:


          - The jack labeled 'module' stays unaltered - for the "single TRS HH input that has Bow and Edge zone for the HH cymbal plus the HH control function" (including the phantom-power)

          - Now, instead of having the second jack labeled 'cymbal', could you do a mod there to have a MIDI-out?

          Something that transmits on MIDI-Channel Omni, Note-numbers 42, 44 and 46, for closed, pedal and open (...or whatever the 2box want to see, to be able to work with, really!)


          Basically, a one-channel Trigger-to-Midi interface inside a HH control-box? Even if that meant that the box itself would be bigger, and had to be mounted offset of the pedal?



          Just ideas...


          "My best friends' name is J-SON. They used to call him 'Mr. Parse.' He has an 'Error'..!"

          http://www.vdrums.com/forum/core/cus...ar33631_4.jpeg

          Comment


          • #9
            I think you guys are almost but not quite getting what I am trying to do:

            - A real pedal connected to the 2box, but MIDI events for the hat hits.

            The Roland TD-9 handles this just fine, not clear if the 2box can or not yet.

            So for the converter box I would not be plugging cymbals into it at all,
            just using it as a pedal.

            I think anyone with a MIDI controller and a 2box could test this easily enough,
            set the MIDI controller to generate hat hits, and use the normal 2box hat pedal
            to control it while whacking on the MIDI controller, if can do open and closed sounds
            then we are good.

            The Roland was a bit finicky with this, there are two MIDI notes Roland accepts for hats,
            one for Open Hat, and one for Closed Hat, one of them was modified by the hat pedal
            and one was not, so it took some trial and error to get it right.

            I just need to get someone to try it for me.

            Alternatively hacking a control pad to have a piezo out for one (or two) of the pads
            would not be that hard, it could even be made switchable so the pad wouldn't
            be ruined.
            Mini-kit: TD-9 + Alesis Control Pad + Alesis Sample Pad + PDX-6 snare
            Micro-kit: Handsonic HPD-20 + an old pair of hands.
            Speakers: QSC-K10 "thumper", DBR-10 "little thumper"

            Comment


            • #10
              The 2box-Manual, p.32, shows that the hihat is triggered on consecutive notes A-2 (45), A#-2 (46) and B-2 (47).
              If the your Control-Pad can be mapped to these note-numbers, you should be able to trigger the hihat this way, with the hihat-controller switching/affecting the notes played.


              Maybe the trick works the other way around too: If the Hihat-controller can be assigned to control other inputs than the hihat-input on the 2box, you could trigger eg. a tom-rim channel with the CP, and assign a hihat -sound to it, controlled by the pedal. Try both ways, I guess...


              "My best friends' name is J-SON. They used to call him 'Mr. Parse.' He has an 'Error'..!"

              http://www.vdrums.com/forum/core/cus...ar33631_4.jpeg

              Comment


              • #11
                Hmmm....I'm confused even more now....sounds like a lot of work to complicate something so simple as just utilizing the 2Box controller and input on the module since it will be right there at your fingertips to begin with.
                8 piece DIY Acrylic, 2x2Box DrumIt5, Gen16 4xDCP, DIY Acrylic&Gen16 Conversions, Sleishman Twin-QuadSteele hybrid, Gibraltar&DrumFrame rack, DW9502LB, Midi Knights Pro Lighting
                http://www.airbrushartists.org/DreamscapeAirbrushRealm

                Comment


                • #12
                  Well... maybe you will end up with a setup that closely resembles that of member 'Tazed'. You will just have a crash cymbal less, but your Samplepad on the snare-stand on the right-hand side instead.



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                  "My best friends' name is J-SON. They used to call him 'Mr. Parse.' He has an 'Error'..!"

                  http://www.vdrums.com/forum/core/cus...ar33631_4.jpeg

                  Comment


                  • #13
                    It's very rough, but I just tried my hands at a little 'picture-merger'.


                    Kurth83's possible Setup





                    Very quick, but this is what your new setup could possibly look like...


                    HTH
                    Last edited by hairmetal-81; 12-16-13, 06:53 PM.


                    "My best friends' name is J-SON. They used to call him 'Mr. Parse.' He has an 'Error'..!"

                    http://www.vdrums.com/forum/core/cus...ar33631_4.jpeg

                    Comment


                    • hairmetal-81
                      hairmetal-81 commented
                      Editing a comment
                      Where is that [beep] picture? I saw it when I uploaded it...

                    • hairmetal-81
                      hairmetal-81 commented
                      Editing a comment
                      ............

                    • hairmetal-81
                      hairmetal-81 commented
                      Editing a comment
                      Trying to attach the picture for (what feels like) the umpteenth time...

                  • #14
                    Guys, can you see pictures?.....


                    "My best friends' name is J-SON. They used to call him 'Mr. Parse.' He has an 'Error'..!"

                    http://www.vdrums.com/forum/core/cus...ar33631_4.jpeg

                    Comment


                    • fulrmr(Daniel)
                      fulrmr(Daniel) commented
                      Editing a comment
                      Nope.cant se them in this post. All your NAMM pics look finr though

                  • #15
                    Ok, I had a great idea for how to solve the hi-hat pedal compatibility to drive a 2box with a MIDI controller.
                    And it would give my existing pedals full compatibility with both Roland and 2box modules.

                    Basically replace my Alesis Control Pad with a Roland SPD-30 Octapad, and plug the pedals into the SPD-30.
                    It has inputs for my existing controllers and looks like it's MIDI is compatible with the 2box,
                    (HH being the main concern, 2box will take CC4 so I don't see any problems there)..

                    Now I just have to build up enough GAS to spend $2k on a new drum kit.
                    We may have to wait a while for that one, since my cheapo kit meets all my needs at the moment.
                    Mini-kit: TD-9 + Alesis Control Pad + Alesis Sample Pad + PDX-6 snare
                    Micro-kit: Handsonic HPD-20 + an old pair of hands.
                    Speakers: QSC-K10 "thumper", DBR-10 "little thumper"

                    Comment

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