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Idea for a DIY hi hat - will a triggered l80 cymbal feel better than a cy-5 cymbal?

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  • Idea for a DIY hi hat - will a triggered l80 cymbal feel better than a cy-5 cymbal?

    Hi all,

    I'm not super happy with the feel of my electric hi hat, so I want to trigger an l80 in the most cost-effective manner possible. Because I have all of the parts at home, I have decided to make my own dual zone trigger with choke. I feel like it's not very cost-effective to buy a top and bottom hi hat when im only going to be triggering and using the top one, especially when I could just buy a crash cymbal for half the price (especially since I don't yet have a hi hat stand, I just would have it static-mounted to my kit). If, down the road, I want to put it on a stand, I've been designing a 3d-printable dome that would fit into the bell on the underside of the cymbal, and would be covered with felt, and I think that would mimic a bottom cymbal pretty decently without altering trigger results. However, I'm not that far yet.

    My question would be, is the improvement in feel between a triggered l80 cymbal and a roland cy-5 as hi hat going to be leaps and bounds better? In theory, if I can dial in the trigger settings enough, triggering should be as good on the l80 as it is on the cy-5. As I haven't really played on an acoustic before, I don't know how much better the feel of an acoustic hi hat would be compared to an electric hi hat. Is it worth the investment (time and money) purely for the feel of an actual cymbal?

    TL;DR - how much better will a triggered l80 crash cymbal feel as a hi hat when compared to a cy-5 electric cymbal?

    Cheers!

  • #2
    Originally posted by COVID-20 View Post
    Hi all,

    I'm not super happy with the feel of my electric hi hat, so I want to trigger an l80 in the most cost-effective manner possible. Because I have all of the parts at home, I have decided to make my own dual zone trigger with choke. I feel like it's not very cost-effective to buy a top and bottom hi hat when im only going to be triggering and using the top one, especially when I could just buy a crash cymbal for half the price (especially since I don't yet have a hi hat stand, I just would have it static-mounted to my kit). If, down the road, I want to put it on a stand, I've been designing a 3d-printable dome that would fit into the bell on the underside of the cymbal, and would be covered with felt, and I think that would mimic a bottom cymbal pretty decently without altering trigger results. However, I'm not that far yet.

    My question would be, is the improvement in feel between a triggered l80 cymbal and a roland cy-5 as hi hat going to be leaps and bounds better? In theory, if I can dial in the trigger settings enough, triggering should be as good on the l80 as it is on the cy-5. As I haven't really played on an acoustic before, I don't know how much better the feel of an acoustic hi hat would be compared to an electric hi hat. Is it worth the investment (time and money) purely for the feel of an actual cymbal?

    TL;DR - how much better will a triggered l80 crash cymbal feel as a hi hat when compared to a cy-5 electric cymbal?

    Cheers!
    It will feel different, if that is better or worse to you I can't say.

    How do you plan to make this dual zone cymbal?

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by frankzappa View Post

      It will feel different, if that is better or worse to you I can't say.

      How do you plan to make this dual zone cymbal?
      I guess by better or worse i mean more realistic to how an actual acoustic hi hat feels.

      My plan is to use piezo-switch triggering (piezo under bow, switch under edge) because from what ive read it seems pretty easy and effective.

      Something like this: https://youtu.be/W6HjxoNGhEU
      Last edited by COVID-20; 05-05-20, 04:59 PM.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by COVID-20 View Post

        I guess by better or worse i mean more realistic to how an actual acoustic hi hat feels.

        My plan is to use piezo-switch triggering (piezo under bow, switch under edge) because from what ive read it seems pretty easy and effective.

        Something like this: https://youtu.be/W6HjxoNGhEU
        It will feel like a real cymbal, however it will be louder if you dampen it. Don't dampen a low noise cymbal. Use a rim rubber. Dampening it like they do in the video will also make it feel less like a cymbal. It will feel more like a table.

        Here is another video that shows a similar approach: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=npnuaguzq6Y&t=161s

        Here is how they usually convert low volume cymbals.

        fa7f771a8da063112b9376d8c633fd5d.png

        As you can see, the only dampening is the rubber around the edge and it works great.

        Comment


        • #5
          Nice. It protects the sticks, and a good place to stick on the edge switch.

          Thats td one of my pet peeves regarding edrumming. I hate the way the rubber cymbal "catches" the stick when playing the HH.
          DTX700, A2E Dixon kit, Yamaha cymbals, FSR HH
          Kit Pix http://vdrums.com/forum/album.php?albumid=613

          My new venture, HiEnd Speakers. : voglosounds.com

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by frankzappa View Post

            It will feel like a real cymbal, however it will be louder if you dampen it. Don't dampen a low noise cymbal. Use a rim rubber. Dampening it like they do in the video will also make it feel less like a cymbal. It will feel more like a table.

            Here is another video that shows a similar approach: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=npnuaguzq6Y&t=161s

            Here is how they usually convert low volume cymbals.

            fa7f771a8da063112b9376d8c633fd5d.png

            As you can see, the only dampening is the rubber around the edge and it works great.
            This is sick, thanks a ton! I think I'll do exactly this.

            Do you think that having that rubber around the edge would mess up the feel of the edge hits of the hi hat?

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by frankzappa View Post

              It will feel like a real cymbal, however it will be louder if you dampen it. Don't dampen a low noise cymbal. Use a rim rubber. Dampening it like they do in the video will also make it feel less like a cymbal. It will feel more like a table.

              Here is another video that shows a similar approach: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=npnuaguzq6Y&t=161s

              Here is how they usually convert low volume cymbals.

              fa7f771a8da063112b9376d8c633fd5d.png

              As you can see, the only dampening is the rubber around the edge and it works great.
              Hi sir. Is the lower hat just sits on the VH11 controller, yeah? Thank you in advance.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by COVID-20 View Post
                Hi all,

                I'm not super happy with the feel of my electric hi hat, so I want to trigger an l80 in the most cost-effective manner possible. Because I have all of the parts at home, I have decided to make my own dual zone trigger with choke. I feel like it's not very cost-effective to buy a top and bottom hi hat when im only going to be triggering and using the top one, especially when I could just buy a crash cymbal for half the price (especially since I don't yet have a hi hat stand, I just would have it static-mounted to my kit). If, down the road, I want to put it on a stand, I've been designing a 3d-printable dome that would fit into the bell on the underside of the cymbal, and would be covered with felt, and I think that would mimic a bottom cymbal pretty decently without altering trigger results. However, I'm not that far yet.

                My question would be, is the improvement in feel between a triggered l80 cymbal and a roland cy-5 as hi hat going to be leaps and bounds better? In theory, if I can dial in the trigger settings enough, triggering should be as good on the l80 as it is on the cy-5. As I haven't really played on an acoustic before, I don't know how much better the feel of an acoustic hi hat would be compared to an electric hi hat. Is it worth the investment (time and money) purely for the feel of an actual cymbal?

                TL;DR - how much better will a triggered l80 crash cymbal feel as a hi hat when compared to a cy-5 electric cymbal?

                Cheers!
                Hi Covid, give a look to my video, a dear friend made a new controller for me, to be located under the hihat pedal, and I used a pair of low volume triggered cymbal... they feel excellent to me! The only thing still missing is the rim rubber, but is on the way!

                https://youtu.be/A9AC0XAjylo

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by josecarlo1129 View Post

                  Hi sir. Is the lower hat just sits on the VH11 controller, yeah? Thank you in advance.
                  No, it has a piece of plastic pipe/tube that makes the moving part on the VH11 controller longer and able to reach the upper hihat. It goes straight through the lower hi hat.
                  They must have drilled a hole in the lower hihat to allow the VH11 part to come through.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by violaole View Post

                    Hi Covid, give a look to my video, a dear friend made a new controller for me, to be located under the hihat pedal, and I used a pair of low volume triggered cymbal... they feel excellent to me! The only thing still missing is the rim rubber, but is on the way!

                    https://youtu.be/A9AC0XAjylo
                    That looks awesome, ill look into that too!

                    Would you say the feel of the low volume cymbal is much better than that of an electric cymbal? Is it a noticeable difference?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by COVID-20 View Post

                      That looks awesome, ill look into that too!

                      Would you say the feel of the low volume cymbal is much better than that of an electric cymbal? Is it a noticeable difference?
                      A low volume cymbal is a real cymbal. Better/worse is a subjective thing. I think low volume cymbals feel much better than rubber and even better than a regular cymbal because they have slightly more give to them than a regular cymbal. However it is pretty much the same feel as playing regular cymbals.

                      Rubber cymbals feel bad to me but I still prefer them to metal electronic cymbals because they trigger much better. The metal ones have problems with the edge switch only triggering medium to hard hits. It can’t pick up low volume hits. If you strike the edge zone softly you will trigger the bow zone.
                      Last edited by frankzappa; 05-06-20, 02:47 PM.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Nice thread. I’m hoping to convert a low volume hi hat and ride soon due to stick noise with my a to e cymbals. I currently only use a rubber profile/rim for dampening. Get the thinnest rubber you can find that is usable for you. The extra thickness definitely messed with my edge-tip technique if you know what I mean. I ended up putting a vic firth rubber tip on the stick which helps with stick noise and the added edge thickness. My ultimate dream though is low volume hi hat and rides and no rubber tip on the stick.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by COVID-20 View Post

                          That looks awesome, ill look into that too!

                          Would you say the feel of the low volume cymbal is much better than that of an electric cymbal? Is it a noticeable difference?
                          Yes, in my opinion the feeling of a metallic cymbal is obviously more similar with a real acoustic hihat! I prefer the metallic. Anyway, is just a matter of habit, once you got familiarity with the rubber ones, also this ones are good!

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by frankzappa View Post


                            Rubber cymbals feel bad to me but I still prefer them to metal electronic cymbals because they trigger much better. The metal ones have problems with the edge switch only triggering medium to hard hits. It can’t pick up low volume hits. If you strike the edge zone softly you will trigger the bow zone.
                            For this reason we decided to use one single trigger on the top cymbal! It trigger very accurate and pick up also the low volume hits.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Aka Wayne View Post
                              Nice thread. I’m hoping to convert a low volume hi hat and ride soon due to stick noise with my a to e cymbals. I currently only use a rubber profile/rim for dampening. Get the thinnest rubber you can find that is usable for you. The extra thickness definitely messed with my edge-tip technique if you know what I mean. I ended up putting a vic firth rubber tip on the stick which helps with stick noise and the added edge thickness. My ultimate dream though is low volume hi hat and rides and no rubber tip on the stick.
                              Which rubber profile are you using? I just ordered this one from ebay and I'm waiting to arrive...

                              https://www.ebay.it/itm/Black-Rubber...53.m2749.l2649

                              Comment

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