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Best way to remove Armor All and start over with 303

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  • Best way to remove Armor All and start over with 303

    White vinegar and water? Water and dish soap? apply 303 on top of the armor all after a period of time? Thanks!

  • #2
    I read one time the way armor all actually works is that it brings moisture to the surface from within the rubber, thus drying the rubber out over time. I've actually seen this happen to show car tires over time.

    I think I would just apply the 303 right on top; hopefully to stop that possible armor all affect.
    Alan
    ______________________________________________
    check out our website to get kits for your Roland module: v expressions ltd

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by amonline
      I read one time the way armor all actually works is that it brings moisture to the surface from within the rubber, thus drying the rubber out over time. I've actually seen this happen to show car tires over time.

      I think I would just apply the 303 right on top; hopefully to stop that possible armor all affect.
      Anything other than methylated spirits for removing Armor All?
      Last edited by clothesburner; 06-25-06, 05:30 PM.

      Comment


      • #4
        I was wondering where you heard or read this.

        In addition to being a drummer, my 'day-gig' for a lot of years was in the engineering field. My specialty was electronics and industrial automation, but I do have a basic understanding of chemical engineering and the properties of polymers.

        Can you provide any links or documentation about this characteristic of 'Armor All' ? If this is true, it would not be a good thing. If it's not really true, it would be good to know that as well, wouldn't you agree?

        John

        Comment


        • #5
          Read the following:

          "Ah ha!! Finally an area where I am an expert!
          ArmorAll is a petroleum based product and will do three things:
          1. It will leave an 'oily' residue on everything it touches.
          2. It will suck out any water that may be keeping trim supple.
          3. It will make you use it (as already pointed out), for the rest of your life. Almost addictive, like a drug.

          If you speak to anyone worth their weight in the Automotive market they will tell you to steer clear of this killer.

          ArmorAll can be cleaned away by using a cloth wetted with Methylated Spirits. Simple wipe on, wipe off procedure.

          If you want to use a similar product (a much better product) then use the water based 303. This doesn't have any of the adverse effects of ArmorAll although it is considerably more expensive!"

          My question is has anyone ever applied Methylated Spirits (also known as denatured alcohol) to their v-drum rubber cymbals and if so, what happened? I fear this stuff is too strong however have found no other way to completely remove petroleum-based armor all. Thanks!

          Comment


          • #6
            http://www.fordf150.net/forums/viewt...a70f52e03ae54e

            Comment


            • #7
              Interesting - tell me more

              Burner,

              Thanks for sharing the basis of your opinion. I still have some questions.

              To recap, you said:
              1. It will leave an 'oily' residue on everything it touches.
              > No question here. . . Never 'Armor-All' your vinyl gymnastics mat!!

              2. It will suck out any water that may be keeping trim supple.
              > You state this as a fact, and it may very well be true. Can you tell us how you reached this conclusion?

              Here is my limited understanding of the subject:

              Armor-All [and other such products] is supposed to protect the exposed surfaces of polymers. A polymer is a solid that has some characteristics of a liquid. Rubber is a natural polymer. Vinyl is a synthetic polymer. All polymers gain their elastic properties from the way the molecules that compose them are arranged and connected to one-another. I'm not sure, but I think a polymers' elasticity naturally degrades over time - and this process is accelerated by exposure to environmental extremes [heat, UV radiation from the sun, Ozone, acid rain, other pollutants]

              If I understand correctly, there is no 'water' at all associated with polymers at the molecular level. If that is true, then your statement cannot be true. Do you have any proof that backs it up in any way?

              I just want to make sure we keep it 'real' - and don't pass on another urban myth as the 'truth'.

              I look forward to your reply and to continuing the discussion.

              Any chemical engineers out there?

              Thanks again!

              John

              Comment


              • #8
                Damn

                My head hurts! You have the wrong forum. This is an e-drummer forum. You must be looking for a Roket Scientest forum.

                Gretsch Catalina Birch Carribean Blue A to EZ conversion w/TD-20, V-Cymbals, BBE 482, Peavey KBA/300, Electric Sticks, Gibraltar V-Rack, Westone UM2 IEM's, Sony MDR-7509 headphones,
                Kit Pic 1 Kit Pic 2 Kit Pic 3... And FOR SALE I have: 3 PD-9's, MDS-10 purple rack w/cables/pad and cym mounts. See classified posts for details or PM me.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by DrumDisciple
                  Burner,

                  Thanks for sharing the basis of your opinion...
                  > You state this as a fact, and it may very well be true. Can you tell us how you reached this conclusion?
                  Actually, I don't think he was making a statement. Instead, I think his intention was to communicate to you the source of his information. But, instead of revealing who his source was, he quoted what his source said. His actual source was the probably the following thread:
                  http://www.vdrums.com/forum/showpost...45&postcount=6

                  Hope this clears up the misunderstanding.

                  -SD-

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    It's not water it's Bis-(2-ethylhexyl)phthlateakadioctyl phthlate, also known as DOP. This is a plasticiser that makes polymers soft and pliable. It evaporates when exposed to UV light.

                    The arguments against Armour All are as follows:

                    *Armour All brings the DOP to the surface and allows it to evaporate quicker. This one is still out. As many studies that show this also show that it doesn't.

                    *Armour All doesn't block UV, thus allowing the DOP to evaporate. This is True as far as I know.

                    *Armour All does not seal the DOP, nor replace it. This seems to be true also.

                    Using Armour All will not protect your rubber pads from exposure and *might* increase the evaporation rate.

                    303 Aerospace Protectant has UV blockers and is not oil based so it does not "build up" over time. Go 303!
                    sigpic

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      We're Getting Somewhere Now!

                      Hey Michael,

                      Thanks for your post. I'd like to know more about this. Got any links or other sources I can look into on the subject? In addition to my interests in Roland, etc. I just bought a Subaru Forester [perfect for carrying drums and electronics between gigs - good on gas too!], and I want to keep the dash and other polymer based surfaces in 'showroom condition' as long as I can.

                      This controversy around 'Brand-A' has been around a while, and I know that sometimes rumors like this get started by people with vested interests in the competition.

                      So, any resources you can point me toward would be very helpful!

                      Thanks,
                      John

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by DrumDisciple
                        Hey Michael,


                        This controversy around 'Brand-A' has been around a while, and I know that sometimes rumors like this get started by people with vested interests in the competition.

                        So, any resources you can point me toward would be very helpful!

                        Thanks,
                        John
                        Hi John.... I think the Web in general would yield the kind of results you are looking for about the validity of the "Bad" Armor All rap. That idea definitely did not originate on this forum. Just a Google search of "Armor All Bad" will get you started. Here's one result:
                        http://www.f150online.com/forums/arc...p/t-20416.html
                        I think many car detailers have claimed that there are better products to use for rubber/vinyl protection. And from what I can tell many detailers refuse to use Armor All.

                        As far as vested interests..... I doubt there are any vested interests on this forum for products like 303 Aerospace Protectant..... I will say though that the 303 works excellent for me on my Roland rubber pads.... And the vinyl/rubber is in perfect condition after using 303 Aerospace Protectant on my yacht... the "SS 303" J
                        Stealth Acrylic Blues kit, Lectrobans,dual zone acrylic picollo toms,Stealth A to EZ Sabian Cymbals,Stealth 2Box compatible HH stand,2 X 2Box Drumit 5 sound modules with external SD card slots added, 32GB capacity cards,custom VST loaded sounds,SPD-30, Alesis Trigger iO,Stealth A to EZ Mini-Congas,Stealth Lectric Bongos,Lectric MOO's, Lectric Blocks,Wuhan Gong & Linear Splash,A to EZ Alu bell, etc.

                        I could tell you where to stick that piezo

                        Stop by my site anytime: Jman's Website

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I had to look up what DOP was. I just remembered DOP. I f I can remember where I read that artical I will post it. So far, the only thing I have found on the internet is hearsay and anecdotal eveidence. Here is a link about DOP though.
                          http://www.chemicalland21.com/arokor...icizer/DOP.htm
                          sigpic

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I work in the water and wastewater industry as a lab tech (no I do not collect turds...), but previous to this I worked as a porter at a car dealership for a while in my highschool/college years.

                            I don't have a spec sheet that says "Armor all contains essence of Satan" or anything like that. I can tell you, the older cars that I would detail, where the customers used Armor All pretty much exclusively did seem more brittle and not as supple. (Keep in mind that this is not rubber. Most interiors, specificly dashboards, at the time were PVC or something similar. PVC = vinyl.) Guys that used it as "tire wet" seem to have a lot more cracking and problems with the sidewalls of their tires too.

                            Now that's just a first hand observation by a guy that was trying to earn tips at the time. I used to talk with the guys quite a bit because it was that type of job. Were the Armor All users using that product consistently..sure, I guess. In a pinch did they maybe use something that could have caused that and make it seem like Armor All was the culprit..who knows.

                            If there's a doubt..don't use anything. Maybe clean them up the best you can and leave 'em alone.

                            Later,

                            E
                            www.mypvshop.com - your source for electronic cigs. Use coupon code "smokeless1" for 10% off every order!!!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by DrumDisciple
                              Hey Michael,

                              Thanks for your post. I'd like to know more about this. Got any links or other sources I can look into on the subject? In addition to my interests in Roland, etc. I just bought a Subaru Forester [perfect for carrying drums and electronics between gigs - good on gas too!], and I want to keep the dash and other polymer based surfaces in 'showroom condition' as long as I can.

                              This controversy around 'Brand-A' has been around a while, and I know that sometimes rumors like this get started by people with vested interests in the competition.

                              So, any resources you can point me toward would be very helpful!

                              Thanks,
                              John
                              John

                              Screw all the research and technical crap. I made the mistake of using that stuff on my black car bumpers and dash. It would be a big, big, big mistake to use that stuff, especially on your car. Did I mention it would be a BIG mistake? The first time I applied Brand A to my car, I was really impressed on how great a job it did. Then after a short time I started noticing a white haze starting to appear. Additional applications seemed to help in the beginning and I used it weekly, but after a couple months of treatment, even that didn't help.

                              After repeated applications to the dashboard it caused drying and cracking. The bumper took on a permanent white haze. I gave up on trying to restore it. My guess is direct exposure to sun, rain and temperature extremes accelerates these problems. Golly gee whiz, according to their website, "Along with the dashboard, Armor AllŪ Protectant is effective for other surfaces such as tyres, door panels, vinyl seats, consoles, window trim, bumpers, vinyl tops and more". Now we don't have "tyres" in my neck of the woods but I did use on other recommended surfaces.

                              Over time, I have had many others relate similar stories just at the mention of the brand name. So, for me, the bottom line is I never used it again. I have to be honest and admit this was quite a long time ago, however, from what I can tell, it's the same old product.

                              Gretsch Catalina Birch Carribean Blue A to EZ conversion w/TD-20, V-Cymbals, BBE 482, Peavey KBA/300, Electric Sticks, Gibraltar V-Rack, Westone UM2 IEM's, Sony MDR-7509 headphones,
                              Kit Pic 1 Kit Pic 2 Kit Pic 3... And FOR SALE I have: 3 PD-9's, MDS-10 purple rack w/cables/pad and cym mounts. See classified posts for details or PM me.

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